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What is the difference between the Catholic Magisterium and the Haredi Magisterium?

שו”תCategory: philosophyWhat is the difference between the Catholic Magisterium and the Haredi Magisterium?
asked 6 years ago

Good evening,
What did Catholic Christianity see in delegating its authority, instructing, interpreting, and deciding on religious questions, and revealing God’s will to a single, unwavering, faithful, and unwavering, such as Jesus’ words to his seventy apostles in the Gospel of Luke 16:16: “He who hears you hears you, and he who despises you despises me, and he who despises me despises the one who sent me.” And thus resolving the question of authority, while its counterpart, Harediism, saw no need to justify its magisterium, does Harediism proceed from the assumption that believers are complete fools?
Best regards, Benjamin, the Synoptic, Gorlin


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מיכי Staff answered 6 years ago
Benjamin, this is really an obsession. Beyond that, the question here is neither formulated nor reasoned. Just a rant to let off steam. I will only answer specific and reasoned questions, and it is advisable to think about them a little first.

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בנימין גורלין replied 6 years ago

After some thought, the rabbi wrote in one of his answers as follows:
“If indeed there is no source, then it could be one of three mechanisms:
A rabbinical decree or regulation.
A commentary on the text.
I understand.”
My question specifically concerns the source of authority of the “Geduil HaDair” who have the ”Daat Torah”, as if they derive their authority from a relationship of authority, in the example of the ”magisterium Ecclesiae” – “authority of the Church” in the Catholic religion?
As I wrote above, the Church saw a need for a source of authority, why don't the “Geduil HaDair” and their followers feel the need to speak?

Benjamin, the unbeliever in authority, Gorlin

משה replied 6 years ago

Perhaps it would be worth creating a special category on the site for rhetorical questions, the purpose of which is to let off steam.

בנימין גורלין replied 6 years ago

Dear Moshe, why is this question rhetorical?
You are certainly welcome to answer my question, please be objective.

מיכי Staff replied 6 years ago

You assume that Da'at Torah is something other than interpretation or regulation. But Benny Brown shows that it is not. That is why the question is essentially irrelevant. The topic of Da'at Torah has already been discussed in another thread, and I don't see what this question adds to the discussion. It ignores what happened there.

22nd of Adar 5771

Benyumin Goyerlin – Shlomoim Rav,

First of all, I apologize for using the Ashkenazi spelling without the Ashkenazi syllable in the body of my words. Since some of the readers of the site are religious-national and some are members of the Eastern Jewish community – I am forced to write in normal Hebrew (Normalish Bel”z).

The source of the concept of central spiritual authority is in the words of the Torah in Parashat Shofitim: ‘If a matter should surprise you in judgment… then you shall arise and go up to the place which the Lord your God will choose, and you shall come to the Levitical priests and to the judge who will be in those days and inquire, and they shall declare to you the matter of judgment… And you shall be careful to do whatever you are instructed to do, according to the Torah that you are instructed to do, and according to the judgment that they tell you, you shall not turn aside from what they tell you to the right or to the left.

This means: The Torah already makes it clear that a central Torah authority is needed so that the Torah does not become like two Torahs. The Sages called this authority the Sanhedrin or the Great Court. Even after the destruction that the Sanhedrin was destroyed by the Ashkenazim, the central Council House still existed in Yavneh, and later in Usha, Shfaram, Zipporah, and Tiberias. From there, instruction was given to all Israel during the period of the Tannaim.

During the period of the Amoraim, the exile had already increased, but there were still central yeshivas in Babylon and in Yisrael from which instruction was given to many countries. At the end of the period of the Geonim, the Torah centers in Babylon and Jerusalem declined in importance, but in contrast, Torah centers arose that constituted a central authority for many countries. Such was the school of Reb and Rav Nissim Gaon in Kairouan, of Hari Migash and Hari Rifa in Spain, of the Rambam in Egypt, of Rashi and the Talmudists in France, of the Rabba in Provence, and of the Ramban and Rashba and their students in northern Spain.

This is the root of the perception that there are Torah greats whose authority is accepted by many out of recognition of their greatness. And in our own generations we have also seen Torah greats who enlightened many with their Torah, such as the Chazon Ish, the Harim Auerbach and the Harim Elyashiv, the Harim Feinstein, the Harim Soloveitchik, the Harim Kook and the Harim Herzog, the Harim Uziel and the Harim Yosef and many others.

Christianity, in its own way, borrowed many things from Judaism, such as monotheism, the weekly day of rest in which people gather to worship God in the house of prayer, etc. One of the things that Christianity borrowed from Judaism was the concept of a central spiritual authority, until this authority became obsolete and the Reformation came and rebelled against it, creating other central centers of authority.

It is worth noting that in Islam, a de facto central religious authority did not develop, because there the de jure caliph, the king, was the successor to Muhammad, and these caliphs were in practice political rulers who had no interest in determining a position on religious questions. A similar situation is also seen in Anglican Christianity, where the king/sect of England is the head of the church and in practice the bishops determine religious matters.

With greetings, Shamshwein Tsvi Leyvigar Halevi

רציונלי(יחסית) replied 6 years ago

Not that I'm that knowledgeable about church matters and all, but it seems to me that one of the main differences - and I'm not saying this cynically - is that Catholic authority mainly includes biblical sermons on prohibitions on homosexuality, abortion, and moral matters here and there.
And I'm not saying this to express disgust against Christianity, but simply to say factually that authority in the ultra-Orthodox Jewish sense cannot really be there because Christianity is mainly religious and very little practical.

I assume that the answer won't satisfy you.

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