Thought books today
Greetings to the Rabbi,
I started studying in a Heder yeshiva this year and I wanted to ask a few questions regarding studying the faith:
A. Is it necessary/advisable/desirable to dedicate daily time to studying faith?
on. What books does the rabbi recommend? (Lesson 1)
C. Do you think there is any benefit in studying the books of Rishonim (Khuzari; Moreh Behumchim; Beliefs and Opinions; Obligation of the Hearts, etc.) or is it better to study contemporary philosophy?
D. Does the rabbi see value in studying the books of Rabbi Kook? Do you think the national religious obsession with his writings is justified?
the. Is there a particular order in studying the faith? If so, what is it? (Which book comes before what, what is fundamental to what, etc.)
Thank you in advance.
I’ll go ahead and say that you’ve fallen for someone who doesn’t see value in all these lessons and doesn’t even see them as learning in a meaningful sense. I explained in the second book in my trilogy.
A. I don’t think so. But to each his own.
B. I don’t have one.
C. In my opinion, very little. Personally, I much prefer contemporary philosophy.
D. There are interesting ideas there, but it’s an eclectic collection. In my opinion, you’ll mostly get a source of inspiration there and less of a study in the full sense.
E. Ordering a set that has no items is a philosophical-mathematical question that is beyond me.
In my opinion, even if you don't agree with certain insights, it's worth getting to know the basic books in the Jewish Aron. I would actually start with the introductions by Maimonides. You'll find important insights for life there.
It is worth reading them in your free time and not while studying (between times, army, etc.). While studying, it is worth reading scholarly books.
Despite the rabbi's disdain, these books provide certain tools both for military service and for the years that follow at university and at work, and therefore it is very worthwhile to get to know them.
As for the reading material here, I would simply wander between the books, old and new, including the Maharlika, Rav Kook, Rav Soloveitchik, and Rav Shager.
It is also worth reading research books such as Micha Goodman's book on the Kozari, David Sorotskyn's book on the Maharlika (in his book you have to sort the chaff from the chaff) and Rubin's book "What God Cannot Do." And of course the Rav's books.
And in my opinion, don't make the mistake that many make (and I am included, it's hard to break away from yeshiva habits) of starting with original literature. Whatever you gain from beliefs and opinions and confused assistants and teachers over many hours, you will gain with greater clarity, sharpness and order from the Open University's books. It's both faster and clearer, a real win-win. After you know the methods and comparisons and key points, you will move on to the original literature. It may not be respectful to read this in a beit midrash, but with conventions of respect one does not lick ice cream. I highly recommend that you shave my beard and that of others in this section.
On the 22nd of Elul, 5772, the brilliant idea came to my mind, to enter the faith and thought classes that the yeshiva offers, as well as to study with a mature man or an avrech.
And of course, the introductions of the Rambam, the Kuzari (for a comparison between their methods, Rabbi Yitzhak Shilat's book "Bin HaKuzari Rambam" will be helpful), the path of the Ramach, the precious Adar and the footsteps of the sheep by Rabbi Kook, and the books of Rabbi Amital and Rabbi Lichtenstein. I detailed modern-style Torah thought literature in my responses to the column on dealing with the question of leaving.
With greetings, Shatz
Of course, books that question the 13 fundamental principles of Judaism – He who guards his soul will keep far from them, and they will be poor, and they will be poor, and they will be poor.
Regarding the suggestion of ‘To the full breadth of your land’, according to the same logic, it should also be recommended not to open the Gemara and the commentaries of the first and last, but to study the Mishnah and the Gemara from the reviews of the ‘Closed University’, that way you are guaranteed that you will never be able to independently study a Torah text 🙂
Greetings, Zorba the Greek, author of the book ‘The Spout of the Kettle’
Regarding R’ Sh”t's suggestion to study chevruta with an avrech and enter faith classes - in my opinion, this is exactly what you should not do. Look around you and you will see that no one knows between now and then, a few fragments have been picked up here and there and are weaving the whole mess into the ropes of the false. It is much better to learn from experts in the field (and I will not know what doubts there are in the orderly presentation and analysis of the words of Rasag). Learning in the Gemara is a different matter that does not only concern expanding the scope of knowledge but also developing the technical skill that requires experimenting with your hands, and this is not something that is done on the side, and also because there is still no systematic literature that is good enough. In my opinion, what will happen here is as usual that everyone will start from the original literature and then later they will reach an organized literature and they will grab hold of the shards and then they will advise others who will also not listen, generation after generation and the missing part will always creep in.
In the 22nd of Elul, 5771
To the Rabbi, Shalom Rav,
Regarding the literature that analyzes and summarizes the thought system of the greats of Jewish thought. There are reliable analyses that use their philosophical knowledge for a correct understanding of the books of thought of the greats of Israel, such as Rabbi Shilat's book "Between the Kuzari and the Rambam"), to which one can add Rabbi Dr. Shab's "Pillars of Israeli Thought" on medieval thinkers and the books of Professor Benjamin (his son) Gross on the thought of the Maharal and Rabbi Kook.
Today's academic literature is the complete opposite of a systematic analysis of the words of the first. Today, the most prevalent are the conspiracy theories, which the early founders of the faith, who deny the principles they themselves set, and this is of course crooked and distorted.
But even true systematic literature, such as the good examples I mentioned above, cannot be a substitute for knowledge and examination of the text in its original form. After you have studied the Gemara and pondered the difficulties and decompositions of Rashi and the Tosafot, then you can successfully approach the Rambam and the Tosh, who strive to reach a summary of things in terms of halakhic law, and the later literature that deals with the conceptualization and explanation of interpretations. You can't put the cart before the horse 🙂
With greetings, Sh”t Zarruby
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… In ’conspiracy theories’ that make the founders of the faith…
It's not exactly ideas that make the Rishonim heretics, it's mainly theories that introduce postmodern ideas into the Rishonim (the contradictions in the teacher to really say that the Rambam himself was debating, the Khazari to show both sides that are right, and so on).
It is not for nothing that I recommended Goodman's book on the Khazars, since many ignore the form of the Platonic dialogue on the ironic aspect that Rachel follows in his footsteps (Shmuel Shkolnikov expands on this aspect in his book on Plato). Many also ignore the obvious contradiction between the frame story of a prophecy to the Khazar king by an angel and the sage's claim that prophecy belongs exclusively to the Jews. Here, there is already proof of Goodman's claim that the sage in the Khazars does not exactly represent Rachel's own opinion. Goodman also expands on the issue of the tree that grows from the seed and that is supposed to encompass the entire human race, which many ignore, getting stuck at the seed stage without understanding that the parable continues in a more universal direction. People also study the proof of the parable of the king of India in a simplistic manner without addressing the difficult problems that this type of proof has. As a result, they understand it as a mathematical proof rather than a phenomenological presentation of Judaism. For these and other reasons, I believe that Goodman's book on the Khozari is highly recommended. His books on Maimonides and the Mensheviks seem to me to be less successful, but Mara Datra has already commented on this, each book in its own right.
Regarding the recommendation of “The Whole Width of Your Country” to read books by the Open University. Can you elaborate a bit on which books you recommend?
In relation to books like Kozari and Moreh Nevukhim, I was specifically referring to the course “Jewish Philosophy in the Middle Ages: From Rav Saadia Gaon to Maimonides”, https://www.openu.ac.il/courses/10412.htm. There are similar courses in both Greek and Western philosophy, and also divided by subject (science, morality, etc.).
By the way, I heard this general advice not long after I started to be interested in the field, but I disregarded it like a gaping young man and went straight to the original literature (Plato's dialogues, have mercy on him. A crazy waste of effort). This is not just a side suggestion from a nameless man from a nameless site, but an accepted way of a king, and thousands upon thousands will offer it to you, check it out and forget it. There is a situation where if you want to learn to philosophize (as opposed to knowing what ideas the philosophers were thinking about), there is an advantage in initial friction with obscure literature because you are also ‘with the king in his work’ and also the fact that the claims are not clear and sharp leaves a lot of room for personal thoughts and no one stands for anything unless they fail at it, etc., and there are also classics that are really worth reading in the original (translated) form. But with regard to medieval Jewish thought books, this is much less significant (in my opinion, etc.), and without a doubt it is much better to study like a human being, from books that will spare you all the technical hassles and allow you to focus on what is important.
Many thanks to the rabbi and the other respondents.
To the rabbi, I would be happy if you could explain your intention, in my opinion you will mainly receive a source of inspiration there and less study in its full sense.
A source of inspiration in study?
Inspiration for life?
What inspiration?
Real inspiration?
Full breadth of your country, I am in a yeshiva that is not very open-minded, if I study ‘criticism of reason’ in the beit midrash, I will be thrown on a rocket, in my opinion.
Inspiration for formulating your own thought. These are not books that constitute a binding source, and most of the ideas there are not really convincing to me, nor are they very innovative. Therefore, I do not see significant value in this study. As mentioned, I elaborated in the second book of my trilogy.
thanks.
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