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How do you determine the laws of modesty when they are subjective? Question about column 499 (A look at modesty and its meaning)

שו”תCategory: generalHow do you determine the laws of modesty when they are subjective? Question about column 499 (A look at modesty and its meaning)
asked 3 years ago

Peace and blessings, Miki,
In column 499, you said that in your opinion, the laws of modesty are subjective to each society (as the Hadbarei Hamudot opinion) so how are the laws of modesty determined?
If society is secular, are the laws of modesty dictated by secular modesty? What is it anyway? How can one decide rules in such a situation? Who determines? I think that such a perception practically sterilizes the laws of modesty. Is it your fault?


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מיכי Staff answered 3 years ago
You assume that halakha always operates with rigid rules, even if subjective. But this is not necessarily true. For example, the laws of loving and fearing God, loving one’s neighbor, honoring parents, adhering to the commandments of God, the Blessed, and more. All of these depend on circumstances and it is difficult to establish sharp lines in them. And this applies to the laws of zisudan in the mitzvot of the Torah. Modesty is not a mitzvah specified in the Torah, and therefore there is no reason at all to look for rigid rules there. Of course, it is possible in principle to establish rules in a certain place and time (if there is an authorized entity to do so), but this would not be universally valid for any other place and time.

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ישי replied 3 years ago

I didn't assume this. I read the column and was convinced that there are subjective laws. I asked a practical question: Who determines the laws if they are subjective?

מיכי Staff replied 3 years ago

You do assume that, otherwise you wouldn't ask who determines and you wouldn't assume that such a situation empties the field of content. Every person and also social norms determine this. There are of course customs involved in such a field.

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