What is the origin of the phrase “Where reason ends, faith begins”?
To dear Rabbi Michael, greetings!
I really enjoy reading your articles and books. Your arguments are beautiful, well presented and supported by evidence.
I remember reading, perhaps in your book on fundamentalism, that the origin of the common saying “Where reason ends, faith begins” (or in various versions) (which is of course not true, and I swear) is from a Christian priest.
From Google searches, I came to articles that write that (almost) all the great men of Israel said this sentence: the Gaon of Vilna, the Grandfather of Kelm, Rabbi Nachman of Breslov (of course), and even the Gerizh of Brisk (!!!) – in none of the above articles is a real, authoritative source cited for saying this sentence.
I would love to know if you know the source of the phrase, and the source where it is written.
Thank you very much!
I don’t remember writing anything like that. I don’t know the origin of the sentence. I do claim that it fits a Christian approach.
Perhaps you mean the sentence "I believe because it is absurd" by Tertullian the Wise
Thank you very much!
Then I searched Google with different wordings,
and found in the conversations of the R”an (Racha) and Z”am: And he said that where the wisdom of philosophy ends – there the wisdom of truth begins, which is the wisdom of Kabbalah. Interpretation: Because the philosophers did not investigate whether even to the Golgotha, and from there and upwards no one knows anything. And also in the wisdom that comes from the scrolls and from the table, they are also very confused, as is known to them by their own strength. And the wisdom of Kabbalah begins at the place where their wisdom ends, as we have seen from the scrolls and from the table. Because the entire “world of work” with the gilgals in general, the entire wisdom of Kabbalah in one box, which is the world of work. And all the wisdom of Kabbalah is its works and its elevation, which is its creation and its health and nobility, elevation by elevation, elevation by elevation, and so on. And also in the action itself, in the interiority of the action, we have understood the spirituality of the action, which the philosophers have no complete knowledge of. But the wisdom of Kabbalah speaks only of the root of the action in spirituality and from there and upwards. It was found that where the wisdom of the researchers ends, the wisdom of Kabbalah begins.
Of course, R’ Natan's words do not mean what is used in this sentence… and his intention is to say that Kabbalah is above philosophy.
But I found the exact formulation in Uzi Hitman's poem – Light to the Gentiles (words in Shironat), which reads:
Where reason ends/ faith begins/ and there are things that we will not be able to prove/ even in a million years.
Because this sentence is used as a very useful axiom in religious debate, it was important for me to know its origin, in order to rule out its use.
I would be happy if anyone knows (real) sources for this sentence.
You can (and should) reject its use even without knowing its origin.
And if you mean that if its origin is Christian you can influence people to stop using it then I'm sorry to disappoint you, they won't stop. They're out of their minds.
The Breslever certainly said this:
The principle and foundation, on which everything depends – to bind oneself to the righteous one who is in the past, and to accept his words above all that he says because he is this, a small thing and a great thing. And to the heart of the linnets, mercy and peace, from his words on the right and on the left, as our rabbis said, remembering them for blessing (Books of Judges): Even if Omer says to you on the right of Samuel and so on; and to cast away all wisdom from him, and to take away his knowledge as if he had no shekel of wisdom except what he receives from the righteous and the multitude that is in the garden. And all the time that remains in his possession is a shekel of his own wisdom, not in completeness, and not connected with righteousness.
Likuti Mohar”n 123:1
“I said, “Whoever follows me and does all that I command, he will certainly be a great righteous man, whatever he may be. And the principle of throwing away the wisdom of his own self to the ends of the earth, as he will say, he will establish everything according to his word. And he said then the matter of the people is wicked and unwise, as is explained in the book of the Proverbs in the book of Proverbs, from the Proverbs of the Chayei Moharan
https://www.sefaria.org.il/Likutei_Moharan.123.1.1?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en
https://www.sefaria.org.il/Chayei_Moharan.320.1?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en
Dear Fromer, after forgiveness, you did not understand what I asked.
I was looking for a source for the above sentence, and not whether in the writings of Rabbi Nachman something similar was said.
Thank you very much.
Dear R’ Israel, I understand. So, I think the source you are looking for is in the writings of the Christian philosopher Søren Kierkegaard, specifically in his book “Fear and Trembling”.
” because faith begins precisely there where thinking leaves off.”
https://www.sorenkierkegaard.nl/artikelen/Engels/101.%20Fear%20and%20Trembling%20book%20Kierkegaard.pdf
I hope this time I have been raised to Mr.
Cheers!
After further searching through various formulations, I found an authoritative Jewish source for this law (I am not discussing the essence of the law, but rather its origin): Rabbi Shach, may God be pleased with him, brought in the name of the Rabbis who said in the name of the Rabbis (Avi Ezri 1, p. 44; on Rambam, answer 5, 5): "And behold, I have always wondered why this mitzvah is called faith, since in its simplicity it is one of the first enlightenments, that it is possible for the world to exist without a leader, and also heralds of God's presence, and the wonderful wisdom in every small creature cannot be estimated, and even more so the wisdom in the creation of man, and how is it possible that all of this is without a leader, and after all, the aforementioned Rambam wrote to know the Lord; for this is knowledge, and in Scripture it is said that the mitzvahs are in mitzvah 1. It is a written commandment that is commanded in the belief in the Godhead
And I asked this of the great teacher Rabbi Yitzhak Zeev Salovetzik, Zacharias, and he told me that he also stood by and asked this of his father, the Gracious One Zacharias, and he told him that certainly *to the extent that a person's intellect can touch, he is intelligent, and this is not faith, and it is knowledge, but the obligation of faith begins from the place where the whole person's intellect is*. And he explained to himself the matter that the intellect of a person, which is not limited in time and place, and what is above time and place, he no longer has any concept of, and the essence of the Blessed One is above time and the place where there is no place for the human intellect, then the obligation of faith applies to him.
And Nami of Beit Halevi noted (Supp. 2), which states:
“And another reason for this is that the main commandment of faith is that we believe in all the words of the Torah and, according to the Kabbalah of our rabbis, even that which we cannot clarify through a conclusive demonstration. For everything that becomes clear to a person through a demonstration is called knowledge and is not yet faith at all *and we are accustomed to believing, and this is in things that the mind cannot grasp through a demonstration*, and as long as he does not believe only in what becomes clear to him through a demonstration, he has no part in the commandment of faith at all”.
May all the helpers and helpers be strong!
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