A guy with mental health problems sitting down
Hello.
I am writing this question after the incident that occurred yesterday in which a young man stabbed his friend in a Haredi yeshiva in Kiryat Sefer, and it was later claimed that the stabbing victim was in a psychotic state. I have personally witnessed other cases in which young men suffering from psychiatric problems of varying severity are present in the yeshiva, and more than once I have seen with my own eyes a severe psychotic outbreak.
The question arises – in yeshiva, as is known, there is a preoccupation with “spiritual” and sometimes even “mystical” content. I am not talking only about yeshivahs where Kabbalah, etc. are studied, but also about dry Lithuanian yeshivahs, where even there it is impossible to escape from preoccupation with “higher” matters, both in the framework of study and in the relationship between the students.
Even studying morality while placing demands on oneself can cause significant mental stress.
In light of this, is there any reason to avoid sending a young man with diagnosed mental problems to a yeshiva? Are yeshivahs supposed to prevent the acceptance of young men with psychiatric problems?
On the one hand, the yeshiva is a kind of Noah’s Ark, protecting him from the dangers of the world. On the other hand, there is concern that the content and atmosphere could worsen his condition.
I want to refine the fundamental question and focus it on the private case of a specific relative, a Baal Teshuvah.
Thanks in advance.
This is a difficult question and I cannot answer it, especially since I do not know the guy and I am not a psychologist/psychiatrist. A psychologist should be consulted to give an opinion. Each case is individual.
Didn't the Chazon Ish say that yeshivas are cities of refuge?
On what basis did you decide that sitting might make his condition worse?
You don't make decisions like this based on gut feelings. This is a professional question that should be asked of professionals (who may also have no idea, and may also answer even though they have no idea, so you need to check it out well). After you have an answer about the risks (I'm guessing that sitting is generally not a risk factor, but my guess is no more based than yours), then the place to go is to ask what is ‘appropriate’.
Yishai
Of course, professionals are also involved..
But since this is a field of the mind where the hidden is greater than the visible and we are not dealing with a virus/bacteria/infection, etc. ’ – I am not convinced that their advice/conclusion is in the nature of “Torah from Sinai” and yet
Regarding my hypothesis/fear (I have not decided…) that staying in a yeshiva could worsen his condition - it is plausible (with the addition of a little experience….)
I am afraid that for a person in a psychotic state (imaginations/visions/hearing voices) staying in a place where “spiritual” matters are dealt with is not exactly the right place.
But this is just a hypothesis and therefore I asked to hear the Rabbi's opinion (not as a halachic ruling but as an opinion).
1.D
I don't know what the prophet said and what he meant - on the other hand, I heard from Rabbi Shach (a second source, not in my ears) that a yeshiva is a place where one is supposed to learn Torah. Whoever is unable to learn - this is not his place (and he was talking at the time about sending a young man to the army)
On the 1st of Elul, 8th of August
Our rabbis have already taught us that idleness leads to boredom (‘boredom’ in the language of the Sages is ‘madness’). When a person is busy with an activity that interests him, his mind is distracted from the anxieties and fantasies that surround him, and his success in that activity raises his self-image and gives him self-confidence, which makes it easier to heal and cope.
There are rehabilitation centers where people with physical or mental problems are integrated into creative work in a supportive environment that suits them (for example, “Hazon Fatiya” in Jerusalem). A few years ago, the rehabilitation center “Shef Yativ” was established, which deals with the rehabilitation of mentally ill people through yeshiva Torah study accompanied by an appropriate professional team.
It seems to the student that a guy with mental problems, and especially when he is being treated with medication, is usually difficult to concentrate on studying for an entire day (which is not easy for a normal guy either), and therefore it is advisable for him to stick to both ways. A few hours a day in the framework of Torah study and a few hours in the framework of work, and together the guy will feel that he is progressing.
The rehabilitation part can also be in a regular yeshiva, as long as there is a good atmosphere of support and help for the weak. In a place where there is a pursuit of achievement while one person is arrogant over another, I fear spiritual harm even for those who do not come with a background of mental problems. Torah study that leads to spiritual elevation should be done with humility and in the company of friends, and then Torah is the “lifeblood” of the luminary. In such a place, the superior will devote some of their talents and time to supporting those who are weaker than them, and this will benefit everyone. If this is not possible within the normal Torah framework, then one should seek a rehabilitative Torah place such as a “Shef Yativ” or the like.
With best wishes, Sh”z Levinger
Rabbi Aharon Yeshaya Rotter testifies (in the Contras ‘Darache Ish’ at the beginning of his book ‘Shaarei Aharon’ on Shulchan Aharon) that the Chaz’a told a man who was a worker and wanted his Rebbe to register him as a yeshiva student, and the Rebbe said that he should ask the Chaz’a.
The man turned to the Chaz’a who replied that if the Rebbe asked him, he would answer not to register him fictitiously as a yeshiva student, because the entire deferral for yeshiva students ‘depends on the Sha'ara’ and if the authorities were to take action against a fictitious registration of a yeshiva student, this would jeopardize the deferral for true Torah students.
A quote from Rabbi Rotter, which I provided in my responses to the articles: ‘Bridge Between the Carts’ and ’No Regrets’, on the ‘Shabbat Supplement – Makor Rishon’ website.
Best regards, Sh”z Levinger
Pook Hezi May Amma says that every clumsy and every deaf person is exempt from military service, whether he is studying or not.
This of course has nothing to do with your friend, since if he is studying he has every right to be in yeshiva, but you just have to think about whether it is wise. I would say that in such a case it would be better for him to request an exemption from the army on mental grounds (which is probably true) and not feel obligated to stay in yeshiva because of the army, even if it is not appropriate for his mental state.
Shchel, the story about the prophet is outrageous (though typical). The problem is not that the other guys won't get a reprieve, but that it's dishonest.
Leave a Reply
Please login or Register to submit your answer
