New on the site: Michi-bot. An intelligent assistant based on the writings of Rabbi Michael Avraham.

On the change in providence in our time

שו”תCategory: philosophyOn the change in providence in our time
asked 6 years ago

Hello Rabbi,
I know your opinion on the matter of God’s providence, and recently I have had thoughts of heresy in your position, my Lord.
I am not sure about the difference you point out between our time and the Bible period, in which you also agree there was providence.
It is likely that their daily life was very similar to ours (and if anything, even worse than ours). There were no sea breaks every Monday, nor were there regular appearances of God to the people. The visible miracles were very spotty.
I am of course not talking only about the period of the Israelites in Egypt and the desert, but about the entire Bible. The days of Ezra and Nehemiah, for example, do not sound to me to be full of overt miracles, and are overall quite ordinary. I would even say quite similar to the period of 80-90 years ago.
The difference you like to point out, and which in my opinion is the only one that is relevant (and not the overt miracles, which were, as mentioned, exceptional even in relation to that period), is the prophecy that existed at that time and does not exist today. While this is true, I am not convinced that this is a fundamental difference. There really is no prophecy today, and the connection with G-d has declined in degree. But to go from here and say that the statements about providence in the written Torah are no longer valid is a very significant leap. I do not see any less reasonableness in the position that says there is no prophecy but the above statements are still valid.
It is important to note that I definitely agree with the statement that we do not see this providence today. The world operates as it is, and the laws of nature provide a very good picture, and therefore there is no reason to say that God intervenes by observing the world. The reason for saying so is from the verses in the Torah that speak of intervention in the world. Also, I agree with you that any intervention is a miracle and an exception to the laws of nature. (By the way, do you think that if today’s science had existed back then, they would have found more unusual phenomena without explanation?)
In short, if there is no significant difference between the periods in terms of daily life and the life of the people, then why say there is a difference in providence?
Isn’t it more correct to say that there was never really a providence? And if so, what do the above verses mean?
thanks,
given


Discover more from הרב מיכאל אברהם

Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.

Leave a Reply

0 Answers
מיכי Staff answered 6 years ago
Since no one considers himself wicked, it is not true to say that you are an apostate in the religion of the Lord. But it is possible to discuss the question itself as the Messiah according to his perfection. The reasoning in my system stems from two claims: 1. Today it is quite clear that there is no divine involvement. You claim that it would have seemed that way back then as well. Maybe, I’m not sure. 2. In the past there were visible miracles and prophecy and today there are none. You agree with that (obvious miracles were exceptional, otherwise they wouldn’t be miracles. So what? Today there is none of that either). Your argument addresses fact 1 but ignores fact 2. The combination of these two leads to the solution I proposed. In my opinion, it is the most reasonable. The alternative requires us to “live in a movie” and not accept what our eyes see, or alternatively not accept the descriptions of the Torah. See also column 243 on this.

Discover more from הרב מיכאל אברהם

Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.

‫נתן replied 6 years ago

Do you think that in the past there were more exceptions to the laws of nature (=providence)?
(I vaguely remember you quoting the Rambam that miracles were “inherent” in the creation of the world, do you agree with him and therefore there are never exceptions to nature?)

‫נתן replied 6 years ago

That is, beyond the visible miracles. For the ordinary person, in everyday life

מיכי Staff replied 6 years ago

I have no idea. Testimonies from people from those times on such a matter are irrelevant, because they did not have the relevant scientific information.

Maimonides does write this, but it does not concern us because from our point of view it will still appear as kin'im (deviations from the usual conduct), and it does not matter whether they are the result of contemporary interference or were imprinted in creation from the very beginning.

Leave a Reply

Back to top button