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Axioms and Postmodernism

שו”תCategory: philosophyAxioms and Postmodernism
asked 1 year ago

Hi Miki, how are you? My name is Assaf.
Every logical argument comes from axioms. Like: 1) Socrates is a human being. 2) All humans are mortal. So the conclusion is that Socrates is mortal.
The axioms are from our intuition, but every person has different intuitions. So every person can conclude different things and we will accept everything equally because it is their axiom. What way do we have to judge which intuitions are more correct, so as not to fall into postmodernism?


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מיכי Staff answered 2 weeks ago
You are using your own intuitions and no one else’s. Therefore, the axioms on which you will build arguments are yours and no one else’s. If there is someone else with different intuitions and different axioms, then you have an argument. Completely legitimate. It is still possible to have a discussion about axioms. The tool used for this is rhetoric, not logic, because logic proceeds from assumptions, and rhetoric is a tool for examining the axioms themselves. Rhetoric is usually a tool for self-diagnosis, that is, a tool that helps you find out what your axioms are. Sometimes you think that your mother believes in X, and when you examine the consequences or just from a different angle, you discover that you were wrong yourself, and in fact you believe in Y. For example, the proof from morality reveals to a person who thinks he is an atheist that if he believes in valid morality, he probably believes in God without being aware of it. And if after all you are still in disagreement, then you have different opinions. What is the problem? If you are troubled by the question of which of you is right, think again about the arguments of the other and come to your own conclusions. If your opinion has not changed, then this is your opinion. See columns 247-8.

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אסף replied 1 year ago

There's no problem being controversial after we discuss, but in the end we'll end up with you thinking this way and me thinking differently “and to each his own truth”. Isn't that a postmodern situation?

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

Absolutely not. Just because there is a disagreement doesn't mean there is no truth. One is right and the other is wrong. Just as when you see several opinions about morality, it doesn't mean there is no absolute morality. One is right and the other is wrong. Everyone acting according to their own truth is not postmodernism. Postmodernism claims that both are right (or that neither is right).

המצטערף replied 1 year ago

“If you are troubled by the question of which of you is right, think again about the arguments of the other and come to your own conclusions. If your opinion has not changed, then that is your opinion”

But if the other has also done so and remains of his opinion, then should his wits remain in doubt??

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

Sure. Do you think he has protection from me?

המשתעלט replied 1 year ago

Of course it is.
a) The rabbi believes in God.
b) The debate about God is ancient in philosophy.
There are many wise people on both sides.
c) Each side knows the other side well and writes a lot about it.
d) Nevertheless, each side decides the question and leaves no doubt. Even though other wise people think differently.
For example, Rabbi Micha Avraham.
Conclusion) You have protection with you.
Over the atheist philosopher.

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

See column 247-8.

... replied 1 year ago

It explicitly says there that in such a case there is no reason to continue with your opinion.

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

You'll probably need to read again.

. replied 1 year ago

There are many places, one of which:
“The question of how the other person formulated his position is relevant in all types of arguments, and therefore it is relevant when deciding whether to stick to my own position. Now this is no longer a special situation, an exceptional example in which the existence of a dissenting colleague has no effect, but rather a consideration that can arise in any argument. Of course, it is not right to apply this to every argument. It can be relevant in any argument, but only if I have truly reached a reasonable conclusion that my interlocutor in this argument did not formulate a position based on a serious examination of the totality of considerations. (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) As I explained above, this is a relevant consideration only if this is truly the case in my opinion”

So do you think that all the atheist philosophers and scientists in the world are truly and sincerely locked up!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??
Or maybe they have reached a different conclusion than you. Because if they are not locked up, then you explicitly wrote that there is no reason to continue to hold your position.

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

Absolutely yes. They came to the wrong conclusion because they were locked up or they made an error in judgment.

. replied 1 year ago

Claiming that they made a mistake in judgment is not an excuse in an article, except if they are locked up and did not check well.
Because otherwise the assumption that you are wrong is the same as the assumption that they are wrong (too true).

And claiming that half of the philosophers and scientists in the world are locked up doesn't sound like a narrow and ad hoc idea to you?

תגובתך? replied 1 year ago

??

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

I wrote my opinion. I think they are locked in. The academic atmosphere leads people in this direction in a very pressing way.

. replied 1 year ago

Sounds illogical, there are so many atheist philosophers that this is a very strange claim.
After all, philosophers know how to challenge basic assumptions, so there is no doubt that they did not reach this conclusion out of a blind faith.
This is the purpose of philosophy, the search for truth.

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

So it's interesting how they come to such different conclusions. Okay, I've exhausted it.

היא הנותנת replied 1 year ago

On the contrary, because man is incapable of reaching the truth. In any case, it is clear why they arrive at different assumptions from each other.

. replied 1 year ago

I forgot to mention that according to studies I've read, most philosophers are atheists.

מיכי Staff replied 1 year ago

So not just half but everyone is wrong, because everyone thinks they have reached the truth.

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