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asked 2 years ago

Peace and blessings!
I saw that the Shasak wrote that engaging in sexual intercourse on Shabbat is exempt but prohibited, and so it follows that it is prohibited by the rabbis. What reason is there to prohibit engaging in sexual intercourse? After all, a person is not at all aware of what he is doing and cannot prevent it, so what good did the Sages do with their regulation? After all, if this is a regulation that aims to create a guard and keep a person away from the offense here, it certainly does not belong, but even if it is said that this is a fundamental prohibition, why would they do it if people cannot abide by it?

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מיכי Staff answered 2 years ago

This is the Reka method, and indeed I was very surprised by it too. In my opinion, messing around is allowed.
Perhaps his method is that he wants to make the person pay more attention and not enter into a state of distraction. Obviously, when he is distracted, the prohibition has no meaning. The prohibition is the entry into such a state (a type of negligence).

השואל replied 2 years ago

I find your suggestion a bit difficult because there is a difference between being careless, where it is clear that it is negligence, and being preoccupied. Being careless is not paying attention to the law, and there it is understood that the person is required to be alert and pay attention to the laws relevant to the situations in which he finds himself, but with regard to being preoccupied, it seems to me unreasonable to require the person to be constantly alert to every detail of his life.

מיכי Staff replied 2 years ago

The question of what is between being careless and being careless is a very difficult one, and the commentators are very confused about it. But there is also a dimension of negligence in being careless. You walk near plants on Shabbat and can pluck some from them as you walk. Of course, you can also be careful if you are aware. This is not constant alertness for every detail in your life, but caution in the laws of Shabbat in a certain place and time when there is a fear of prohibition. Not bad at all. But as mentioned, I am inclined to the opinion that it is truly permissible.

מיכי Staff replied 2 years ago

Clarification note: Contrary to what you say, negligence is also a failure to pay attention to reality, not just to the law. See Mishnat Shabbat p’ a great rule.

מתן replied 2 years ago

Regarding your confusion about Ra'a, it seems to me that this issue can be clarified with the help of one of the investigations of the deciphering of the code in the Responsorial Psalm. It investigates and attempts to clarify from the words of Chazal whether mitzvot must be performed or whether they will be performed. Similarly, regarding the desecration of Shabbat, is the desecration determined according to the person for whom the situation is completely permissible and he has no problem with it, or is there a fundamental problem with the act itself, a problem that may throw a consequence back at the person himself.

מיכי Staff replied 2 years ago

These investigations always seem dubious to me. Certainly in a blanket statement. But in any case, it's about a rabbinic prohibition, so it doesn't seem relevant to me.

פאפאגיו replied 2 years ago

First, Reka himself distinguishes between the laws of Shabbat and other prohibitions, stating that on Shabbat there is no prohibition when one is engaged in the work of thinking, since the Torah forbids it.
Secondly, the explanation is very simple: even if the man did not commit a transgression, in this case he violated the hafza of isura (and even though, according to the rabbi, Epicurus does not transgress the prohibitions, here it has the meaning of a prohibition)

יאיר replied 2 years ago

Here it is clear that he did not violate the purpose of the prohibition because according to the Torah it is permitted. The whole discussion is why the Sages created an additional layer.

יאיר replied 2 years ago

Continued: The fact that something is considered a forbidden object in other places does not mean that it is also considered a forbidden object on Shabbat, but that it is not obligatory, and this is because the reason it is not transgressed on Shabbat is that Shabbat prohibitions are fundamentally different and it is not appropriate for something to be considered a forbidden object on Shabbat.

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