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The decisive point in time regarding permanent/permanent law

שו”תCategory: Talmudic studyThe decisive point in time regarding permanent/permanent law
asked 1 year ago

When a certain object is fixed in place, it is considered as a half-trunk, and when it is separated from the group to which it refers, it is considered as a partridge and the same applies. However, I am unable to formulate an answer: When I ask myself whether the object was fixed or separated, to what point in time exactly am I referring, at what point in time should it have been fixed in place or separated? It is clear that this is not the moment when doubt arises in the person in practice, because there is a fixed rule even when a person bought in a store and knew which store it was and then forgot. I tried all kinds of formulations, such as “the moment when theoretically doubt could arise,” but in all of them I found a contradictory example. So, what is the determining point in time regarding fixed/separated?

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0 Answers
מיכי Staff answered 3 weeks ago

This is the moment when doubt is born in reality (not in the person). When he took a piece from a store, he is now satisfied with what the situation was at the moment of taking it.

שואל replied 1 year ago

According to this, what happens in Frisch's case? Let's assume that instead of the person taking the piece out of the store himself, a crow took the piece and took it out. Why say that the doubt in reality is born at the moment of finding the piece on the street and not at the moment of finding it in the store? What is the criterion that determines when the “birth of doubt in reality” is?

mikyab123 replied 1 year ago

In the permanent, the doubt is about the store (which store it was taken from), and in the partial, the doubt is about the piece. Therefore, the determining moment in the permanent is when it was in the store, and in the partial, it is the moment I found it.

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