The Midrashiyah: “Once There Was a School” (Column 577)
With God’s help
Disclaimer: This post was translated from Hebrew using AI (ChatGPT 5 Thinking), so there may be inaccuracies or nuances lost. If something seems unclear, please refer to the Hebrew original or contact us for clarification.
Last Saturday night the film “The Midrashiyah” was broadcast on television, and the internet and media have been in an uproar. Many alumni feel it is a kind of requiem, a funeral for a glorious institution (“the flagship of the religious-Zionist movement,” yeah, right), and not without reason. One should remember that this institution in fact passed away some fifteen years ago, and the film follows its final years. The questions are: Does the film do the Midrashiyah an injustice? Does it present a distorted picture? Is this a picture of only a few final years, or was this the situation in earlier years as well? What do we have to say about this picture? Was it really the flagship? Is this what a flagship is supposed to look like?
There are quite a few emotions here—some belonging to alumni and admirers whose sentiments (which themselves are a fascinating phenomenon) lead them to paint the past in exaggerated pink and to be angry at the image that looks back at us from the film and at the impression the Midrashiyah receives from it. On the other hand, there are outraged viewers who see the images of terrible vandalism and argue that we must not look at positive aspects, even if there were a few hiding within the storms, because overall this is systemic madness that has no justification and cannot have any. One thing is clear: in all these issues, everyone—on all sides—is very adamant.
A few days ago I was asked on the site for my opinion, and I thought the time had come to write something about it. Many aspects arise here, and I myself, as an alumnus (with sentiments), am of course personally involved in the matter. I knew the Midrashiyah as a student, a bit as a teacher, and also as a member of the governing council, from several angles and in several periods. I initiated and accompanied innovative curricula, and I saw what took place there in different eras. I was in very close contact with Rabbi Yagel (of course only after finishing my studies), and also closely connected with the figures who came after Rabbi Yagel, so I am familiar with what happened then as well. I could write an encyclopedia here on the various aspects of the film and of the Midrashiyah itself, but I will try to fit the important matters into one column.
Background
The Midrashiyah was founded in 1944, and in its early years the situation of the religious public was dire. Until the 1950s, youths wearing kippot could not walk freely in Tel Aviv. More than once they were beaten and cursed, and they preferred to wear a beret rather than a kippah. The feelings of inferiority were severe, and with some justification. The “masters of the land,” the “new Jews,” felt ownership of it (to some extent justifiably, due to their contribution to its establishment) and greatly disdained the “dosim” (religious folks). It is no wonder that the religious public was gripped by an inferiority complex and lost many of its best sons. It was not comfortable to remain part of this miserable, humiliated public, especially in the face of the dizzying success of secularism and modernity.
Yisrael Sadan, chairman of Mizrachi Youth (=Na’am), decided to act. He invited Rabbi Yehoshua Yagel to join him in establishing a high school yeshiva that would change this situation: “Midrashiyat Noam.” They dreamed that its graduates would compete with the finest youth in every field and even surpass them in science and technology, academia, Torah learning, physical culture, the army, the arts and culture, the media, and so on. Do not belittle the pioneering spirit of this enterprise, which may sound trivial to many of us. It was a project to change a generation’s image and to create a model of a (religious) Jew entirely anew. The ideas may have been in the air, but I think these two individuals were the first to formulate them and try to turn them into a practical plan.
Even before the Midrashiyah there was the yeshiva of Kfar HaRoeh, founded by Rabbi Neria, but that was an agricultural yeshiva, and it seems that at least over time its goals were a bit different. They were mainly along the lines of pioneering (i.e., settling the Land of Israel in its classic sense—echoing the words of the Chatam Sofer about agriculture in the Land of Israel), contributing to society, and realizing the vision of Rabbi A. Y. Kook and his son, Rabbi Tzvi Yehuda Kook. That was not the goal of Sadan and Rabbi Yagel. They spoke of a new Judaism integrated into all areas of life, not of another niche. Later, the yeshiva in Kfar HaRoeh became a high-school yeshiva, and in that sense the Midrashiyah was the first high-school yeshiva. As noted, in my understanding its vision was fundamentally different from that of Kfar HaRoeh and Rabbi Neria.
Their model was the agricultural schools, in the style of Kadoorie. From there emerged a generation of secular leaders, and Rabbi Yagel and Sadan aspired to create a “Kadoorie” for the religious public. Even the terminology was borrowed from there (“Alifim,” etc.). The oath ceremonies, the traditions, the students’ independence and education toward initiative, the high expectations, the slogans, and so on. And of course also the wildness and lack of boundaries.
One must admit that this enterprise succeeded. Many followed in its wake, and thus the situation familiar to us today came to be: graduates of religious education are integrated into all fields. This may seem self-evident to many of us, but to a great extent it is the result of that same bold vision and project. To this very day, additional tasks are added in the same direction: the army, media, academia and economy, art, and more. All these areas are slowly entering the sphere of relevance for the religious person. Even today there are fields where this is not self-evident and certainly not complete, and therefore—regardless of debates about who came first—it is important to understand the pioneering spirit in the vision of these two figures. Yisrael Sadan’s pathos when he spoke of “flagships” and “the elite of religious Zionism,” and other phrases that sounded fairly amusing to us—and sound even more so today—were in fact not ridiculous at all. This was a far-seeing vision by a man who, in my judgment, did not receive sufficient appreciation. I think the vision belonged mainly to these two, though its realization happened thanks to many other people and institutions.
If you ask today who effected the revolutions in religious culture that we witness to this day, very few will point to Sadan, and even fewer to Rabbi Yagel (who is viewed as Haredi, not entirely justly). Most of the public does not know them at all. They will speak to you first of Rabbi Neria and Rabbi Kook, and afterward of Uri Orbach (media), the early Gush Emunim (settlement and pioneering), Rabbi Eli Sadan (army and pre-military academies), Rabbis Goldvicht and Amital (hesder yeshivot), and more. But without drawing comparisons and without detracting from any of these figures, in my opinion Rabbi Yagel and Yisrael Sadan were, in a certain sense, the two founding fathers of this vision, and their contribution to its realization was decisive. All these later developments were built upon their vision and continued it in different directions. We must understand that they did not envision an institution, but rather a different kind of Jew. The institution was merely the means. Therefore, judging them through the institution is a fundamental mistake. One should judge the realization of their vision, even apart from the success of the institution (which I will address).
As an anecdote, when Rabbi Yagel passed away, I thought there would be an earthquake: conferences, books, endless meetings and TV programs. But in practice there was mostly a thin, small voice. To the extent that the only significant eulogy written about him (as far as I know) was an article of mine in a local paper in Petah Tikva (edited by Moti Zept, “Dalet Sheli”). Years later some book came out that I don’t know who has heard of, and there were a few gatherings—truly minimal. From time to time I discover, to my amazement, that when people want to quote something written about Rabbi Yagel, my words are what appear. This is quite astounding if one considers this man’s contribution to the religious and Israeli public in general, to all of us. And I have not yet spoken about Yisrael Sadan, whose memory has almost evaporated from the Israeli—and even religious—collective memory.
The Midrashiyah
Rabbi Yagel was a very non-conventional person. Stories of the early years tell of wild motorcycle riding and joining in fights with street toughs in Pardes Hanna. But what I myself encountered with him was decidedly unusual as well. He gave students a rather long leash, usually in the form of prohibitions with a wink. The rules were at most recommendations, and their enforcement was very weak. Class committees were a significant decision-making institution in the school. Even in our time the students were very independent and wild. We too had escapades and strikes like those seen in the film, and of course a bit of vandalism and fights (albeit at a very different level than what the film shows). I assume that the character the Midrashiyah took on was certainly influenced by Rabbi Yagel’s personality and by his educational approach and conduct.
Our conduct—and that of the administration (which turned a blind eye and allowed many things)—was very irresponsible, and it amazes me that the film shows only two who drowned and another who was paralyzed in the lower half of his body. From familiarity with how things were done, I would have expected much broader and harsher outcomes from the band of rascals who behaved there as if the place were their own. But this is a result of independence and initiative.
The Midrashiyah accepted students from all strata of the population (contrary to the myths, it was not very hard to get accepted to “the Oxford of the religious public,” “the flagship,” etc., yeah, right). Many received there an opportunity they would not have received in comparable institutions. No one made an issue of Sephardi or Ashkenazi among us. It simply played no role whatsoever for us, and this was reflected in the student body. This was very unusual compared to what was then common (and apparently even today the reality is not yet complete in this regard). My good friend, Rami Buchris z”l (killed as an armored corps officer in Sinai), an impressive and talented young man with an amazing personality from Kiryat Yam, and of course of Mizrahi origin, told me that he was not accepted to “Netiv Meir,” and you surely won’t be surprised that they didn’t quite bother to give him explanations.
Rabbi Yagel’s motto was study partners (havrutot) for all studies, including general studies. We did not leave the weak by the wayside, and there was built-in assistance for anyone who needed it (sometimes by non-conventional means, as was our way). The film also showed the mutual responsibility of these “wild men” for their friends. This was truly a supreme value—and not only for doing harm. The values that governed the institution’s conduct were personal independence, student autonomy along with constant struggle against the administration, initiative, camaraderie and mutual aid, social cohesion, social awareness (though not necessarily more than elsewhere). I must say that studies—both secular and sacred—were not an essential part of being there. Someone in the film said he was not a student at the Midrashiyah but a resident, and it reminded me that when I’m asked whether I studied at the Midrashiyah I always say that I resided there for about four years. But one should know that even those who did study (the nerds) did not violate the basic values: accepting the authority of the democratic majority. If it was decided to run away or strike—everyone was in.
One must understand that such conduct has significant costs. When you give authority and open possibilities to wild kids, you sometimes get severe storms, rampages, and sundry “attacks.” In the end you also arrive at a complete loss of control, as happened in the later years. But we must not belittle the benefits of this policy. As the film discussed, the Midrashiyah brought out of most of us something that could not have emerged elsewhere. It allowed us to bring out everything, with all the attendant costs. I know that I myself held simultaneously two utterly different personas and modes of conduct, one at home in Haifa (and in Bnei Akiva there) and the other at the Midrashiyah (and in Bnei Akiva there). It was something entirely different.
As for the product of the institution, I think it has several characteristics. In the end, the vast majority of these “wild men” became fairly bourgeois people (as someone in the film put it), decidedly normative and productive. I am not impressed that more criminals or more violent and less moral people came out of the Midrashiyah compared to other places. Those stormy years did not truly build problematic elements within us for the long term, but they did contribute unique contributions to our personalities that appeared later, most of them for the good. Just an anecdote: in our cohort in the army, of all the hesder soldiers in the armored corps (and the overwhelming majority then served in armor), 12 guys went to officers’ course. Of them, 11 were from the Midrashiyah. I think our percentage among all the hesder guys surely did not exceed 10%. I don’t think that’s mere coincidence.
That said, it must be honestly stated that in my estimation the myths about the prominence of the alumni in Israeli society are greatly exaggerated. In my view there are institutions whose alumni stand out far more in every field (such as “Netiv Meir”), whether in Torah, academia, public life, or the army. The institution was also accused of not leading an ideological stance. The ramim (faculty rabbis) were more diverse than in most other places, and the fact is that both they and their students underwent processes in all directions. There was a myth that they tried there to “burn” students toward the Haredi direction, but the truth is that anyone who knew Rabbi Yagel understood that this was not his issue at all. He wanted the students to study Torah, and it mattered little to him whether that was in Ponovezh, Hebron, a hesder yeshiva, or Mercaz HaRav. So looked the ramim he brought in, although among them there were indeed those who tried to “burn” students. Everything went there, and each one pushed in his own direction. There was no line dictated from above.
This does not mean there were no fierce debates—as is the way of teenagers—but ideology was not an educational issue in the institution. In a certain sense one can say that the value the institution instilled was the absence of ideology. Study Torah, be a good person who contributes to society and succeeds in his field, and all is excellent. I don’t care how you relate to Rabbi Kook or which party you vote for. When I was on the governing council, the parents (who, in principle, had no representation there)—some of whom looked like classic Mizrachi-types—tried to influence us to appoint a Haredi rosh yeshiva, as opposed to a candidate who taught at a hesder yeshiva. For me, that was a formative event. In my eyes this is a unique and very important message that you will not find elsewhere. The signal emanating from every corner was that ideologies and politics don’t really interest us—only substance. So when people say the Midrashiyah had no uniqueness (see for example here), I think that was its uniqueness. All the yeshivot with “great uniqueness” are, to me, very un-unique. There is no shortage of yeshivot painted in clear ideological colors (the “Line” yeshivot). There are thousands of those. In my view it is precisely here that the lack created by the Midrashiyah’s closure is felt. A color is missing in today’s educational landscape.
Dukov, in his article, argues that this means there was no message and therefore no significant influence on society, but I think he is wrong. Indeed there was no “line,” but that itself was the message, and this “line,” as noted, was decidedly unique—far more than any rigid ideological line. In my impression, Midrashiyah alumni are very rare in the world of “the Line,” certainly in its rabbinic leadership. The Midrashiyah’s contribution is not measured by this or that ideological line, but that is not what it sought to create. It sought to contribute to society in every field and every shade, and that it did. I personally miss this very much today.
By the way, as part of that same policy, a situation arose in which different people holding very different views (not just “seraph” versus “super-tzaddik”) feel part of the same family—with great commitment and deep connection to their friends—and with the strongest sentiments toward the institution, toward Rabbi Yagel, and of course toward their cohort. I think this was created there thanks to that policy and that lack of a “line.”
It cannot be denied that this too has costs. First of all, our ability to sit and learn in the post-high-school yeshiva was not among the most splendid (I think Yeshivat Har Etzion regrets to this day that it accepted such a number of Midrashiyah alumni. The Netiv Meir guys our age founded the hesder yeshiva in Ma’ale Adumim). Beyond that, the rate of becoming secular among Midrashiyah graduates was relatively high, since there was no ideological indoctrination. Everyone was accepted and contained, and Rabbi Yagel upheld a policy of not expelling anyone (except in extreme cases where great harm was caused to others). The alumni belong to all sorts of strata in the population, outlooks, occupations, and affiliations, and I gather that the distribution is broader than is usual in other institutions. In Dukov’s piece you can see the list of rabbis he brings from Netiv Meir, and you can see that the quantity is large but the variety is quite limited. As I wrote to someone, the differences are mainly in questions like whether Rabbi Kook was a seraph or merely a supremely exalted tzaddik—shades this way or that, between Har Etzion and Mercaz HaRav and “the Line.” In the Midrashiyah, by contrast, most of the rabbis who emerged became Haredi. There was no ideological line.
From this it follows, as I explained above, that when examining the institution’s and its founders’ contribution, it is a mistake to look only at the alumni and what “color” they have (if they have a color at all). As I explained above, this was a pioneering institution, and as such all the products of the high-school yeshivot are, to some extent, products of Rabbi Yagel’s and Yisrael Sadan’s vision. The impact of these two figures on society should be measured far more broadly than by the place occupied by the alumni, or by whether they created this or that specific ideology. They created a platform upon which numerous, diverse ideologies could be cultivated (some of which, I assume, they would not have agreed with). Most of these colors were present within the institution itself, but certainly were not excluded by it. This is an entirely different measure.
The Film’s Portrayal
The film addresses all these aspects—the lights and the shadows—and in my opinion conveys them faithfully. It certainly raises difficult questions, but the picture it presents is credible and representative. The thesis arises there that the situation changed following Rabbi Yagel’s replacement, but I do not think that is the point. He himself was replaced in part due to the sense that control was being lost. In other words, the loss of control was the cause, and Rabbi Yagel’s replacement was the result—and not the other way around. One can attribute the loss of control to many things, some of which are raised in the film. I do not think Rabbi Yagel’s absence was very important in this regard.
All the phenomena I have described thus far were well presented in the film. And they existed in our time and probably before us, and did not begin with Rabbi Yagel’s departure. On the contrary, as I explained, many of these aspects were created by him and under his inspiration (though they sometimes went too far). Apparently, such independence for young students, irresponsible conduct, and an emphasis on originality and initiative ultimately lead to a loss of control. The images shown in the film are shocking—systematic and gratuitous destruction of property, terrible disrespect toward teachers and rabbis—at levels we did not know in our time. But these are differences in intensity, not in essence. The elements that led to it were all present earlier. They are embedded in the institution’s DNA.
One can see this by way of an anecdote. When I joined the governing council—a formal body full of very important and well-known figures—the first thing I said at the meeting, to the astonishment of all the celebrities there, was that this institution has no right to exist and should be closed. Needless to say, everyone hushed the cheeky youngster—but to my credit, after not many years (about twelve), everyone understood that I was right, and that is exactly what happened. Incidentally, when I said this (around 1994) it was not because of the situation at the Midrashiyah at that time, which I did not really know, but in light of what I knew from my own time. This teaches that the change of recent years was not essential. The problems were there all along.
The feeling among many alumni that the film presents a biased and unbalanced picture is, in my view, mistaken. It stems from the fact that the visual dimensions of the vandalism in recent years are so strong that they overshadow all the other aspects—good and bad alike. If you ask someone who watched the film, he will usually tell you that the film is nothing but a collection of wild rampages in the style of “Lord of the Flies.” But that is simply not true. The power of those scenes captures all attention and does not allow people to notice the other aspects presented there and to understand that the picture is more complex than a set of scoldings and expressions of shock that you can read in the press these days. Most of what I have written so far also appeared in the film, but it is not seen amid the storms and plumes of smoke.
Needless to say, in the general press there were those who linked this to the settlers’ recent rampages; others sharply criticized the elitism and the rowdiness. Many feel that this institution was a prolonged damage. Here the roots of right-wing and religious wildness were exposed. Each one hung his own notions on this film—needless to say, without real justification. On Facebook I read assertions rejecting the claim that those who “weren’t there” cannot understand. “You see the film and you understand everything.” It’s a collection of creatures who would have been better off never created, period. Well, that critique is rash and unserious. In my opinion you really cannot understand—certainly not just from watching the film—but of course that does not mean one cannot critique what was in the Midrashiyah and what is shown in the film.
Now I would like to touch on several questions that arise from watching the film.
A. On the Value of Cohesion and of Vandalism
As noted, social cohesion was a very central value (with clear encouragement from above). Even after we finished our “statute of rampage,” we all have a very deep sentiment for the institution and for our friends, and also for the rest of the alumni of all cohorts. Each of us knows the situations in which you encounter a Midrashiyah alumnus somewhere—from any cohort you never heard of, with decades of age difference—and you need only ask which cohort he is from and with whom he studied, and there is a good chance you will receive enthusiastic help and VIP treatment. Our family connection is not confined to those like us—those who think like us or live like us. It is a kind of family, and therefore it is not dependent on ideologies and outlooks (as noted above). Even in the film you could see that once an alumnus hears that this is about the Midrashiyah—and especially if the filmmaker is making a film about the Midrashiyah—he immediately pitches in. But only if the director portrays the Midrashiyah well, of course. He must not show images and videos unfit for the sensitive eyes of a Jewish mother, even if that is the unvarnished reality. The concern for the Midrashiyah’s image and the deep sentiment toward it are shared by alumni within and outside the film.
Someone wrote to me that cohesion—and certainly sentiment—is not a value but a means, and it has little meaning if it serves negative ends. I replied that I disagree, for several reasons. First, it is not true that cohesion served only negative ends. Many very beautiful phenomena took place there, and without the value of cohesion they would not have occurred. Beyond that, the same questions can be raised regarding vandalism. If this vandalism did not yield problematic long-term outcomes (in terms of the alumni’s personalities), can we condemn it and claim there is no justification for such an institution? Perhaps it helped generate positive outcomes that would not have occurred without it?! It’s true that the guys took out their fury on trees and stones, but that too was only a means. Ultimately, the educational product is no less important.
I am not claiming that vandalism is marginal or unimportant—only that it cannot be judged in a one-dimensional way, solely from the emotional turmoil created by watching those shocking scenes. Here we have an institution that took risks and created results that, in my eyes, are very significant and very unique. A dangerous approach like this has advantages and disadvantages, and I have already stated my claim that it lacks justification (and therefore I recommended closing it), but to look at that approach and judge it through the prism of what happened within it, without reference to the educational product, is in my eyes a superficial judgment. It seems to me that the “square” nature of religious and yeshiva education is among its inherent weaknesses, and therefore one should indeed appreciate an institution that takes upon itself to deviate from it, despite the risks involved in such extreme deviations.
The judgment of positive values like cohesion and of negative values like vandalism is not one-dimensional and not as simple as it seems at first glance. The story is more complicated.
B. “Lord of the Flies”
It is hard to ignore the association with the phenomena of Lord of the Flies. When a group of children finds itself in some closed, isolated space, very extreme phenomena develop there. Part of the point is that completely normative children can arrive at very extreme behaviors. That is what happened at the Midrashiyah. Most of us (including yours truly) were good Jerusalem kids, and anywhere else we would have grown up conventionally—square and ordinary—doing our matriculation, going to study accounting, and that’s it. Without breaking any fluorescent lights along the way, without throwing burning cars off the roof, without breaking bones and paralyzing a boy, and without killing a few kids by drowning.
This is a fascinating phenomenon, and one should pay attention to it. But we must understand that this behavior does not necessarily reflect evil. There is an eruption of youthful mischief to extreme levels and without the responsibility and understanding of adults to balance it. I do not think there were phenomena of essential evil there, and I believe our future lives as adults prove that. Therefore, as I explained above, while there is room to judge these phenomena in themselves, it is important to take perspective into account.
For example, Rabbi Bloch, the last rosh yeshiva (a friend of mine), appears in the film as a weak man grievously hurt by students who disrespected him. But from personal acquaintance with him and with the situation, I know the reality is exactly the opposite. He is a charismatic person whom the vast majority of students adored. To this day alumni of all kinds—secular and religious, Haredi and otherwise—make pilgrimages to him. And despite the admiration and great love for him, you can see in the film what they did to him. From this you can understand that these were acts not arising from true deliberation. These are youths who do not truly control their urges and boiling blood. They do non-normative acts that are, even in their own eyes, irrational. Such are the ways of youth, and when they act without bounds—the sky’s the limit, for better and for worse. This brings me to the question of herd behavior.
C. The Individual and the Herd
Another facet of “Lord of the Flies” is herd behavior. What causes normative teenagers to descend into such abysses is the herd. Watching the film, the experience is one of a rampaging herd trampling the individual in its path. Everyone looks like a collection of rampaging clones, and you wonder where the differences in personality have gone. I already mentioned that collective decisions were respected by everyone, including the “squares” (geeks/nerds). Seemingly extreme collectivism. But at the same time, the speakers in the film said something entirely opposite: that the Midrashiyah brought out of them whatever was inside them—on condition it was authentic. It sounds as if it encouraged extreme individualism, with its lights and shadows. It reminds me a bit of Monty Python (see column 249), in the scene where the whole crowd shouts “We are all individuals!” while one marginal fellow whispers, “I’m actually very conformist.”
In my experience too, the Midrashiyah certainly encouraged individualism. Surprisingly, that brazen herd behavior and collectivism does not contradict the individualism inherent in it. A person comes to expression within the collective, and it is precisely this that allows him to bring out very individual dimensions. The question is what place he occupies within the collective, which directions he pushes, how creative he is, and so on. Everyone is invited to lead the collective in his own direction, to propose ideas, to ask for backing, and so forth. Any initiative is welcome, and there will always be some who will work to promote it. If it catches on, it will receive backing and the whole cohort will join. If not—then do it alone. And if they send you home, don’t worry: the class committee will threaten that the entire cohort will leave and “you won’t see us here anymore.” We won’t leave you alone.
Somehow, the individual found maximal individual expression precisely within a rampaging collective. It may sound very “Kook-ist,” but the experience from the Midrashiyah is exactly that. All those rampages were the convergence and integration of a collection of extreme individualists—even though one might mistake the overall image for a herd of clones. If I may recall the claim from Facebook that an outsider can understand it—I repeat: absolutely not. An outsider truly and sincerely will not understand it. Watching the film is very misleading in these aspects, and those who did not experience it from the inside will indeed reach mistaken conclusions.
D. The Role of a High School
Another question that arises is the extent to which a high school is an educational (academic) institution. Most of us did not study much there, but we made up the gaps rather easily (with the help of friends and mutual responsibility). We invested our energy and time in entirely different aspects of life. Did we lose something? If we had all behaved nicely, then we would likely have engaged in orderly, intensive study. What exactly would have come of that?
This raises the question of whether the time has come to re-examine the role of the school. A boarding school is a kind of laboratory preparing us for life, and basing everything on studies misses something very fundamental. It suppresses initiative, responsibility, and friendship—though of course it leads to calmer, more peaceful outcomes. The disturbances and “pogroms” you saw in the film were indeed acts of horror, but they had significant results, even if not measurable.
E. The Status of Students in School
There are different models that give students status in school. There are democratic schools, and there are various institutions that place trust in students, and so on. The Midrashiyah had something of this, but in a different form. In a democratic school you give students status, but you steer them to make the “right” decisions (there are well-known tricks to achieve this. This is the art of a democratic school principal). But this is a simulated, somewhat fictitious democracy. The reason is that full independence and true status for students is dangerous—certainly when dealing with those you cannot truly trust. But it is an experiment whose risk carries the potential for very different achievements. The administration there knew that recognizing the students’ status could lead them to act against it. It is not clear that it knew, but it turned out quickly that it could also lose control over them, as indeed happened in the end. Even so, it is an educational experiment whose value and significance I would not dismiss.
This independence and sovereignty have ramifications that build something very deep within the student, and the fruits can be reaped later on. I am not here to decide whether it is right to do this. On the contrary, in my judgment it is not right and not responsible to do so (as I also declared in the governing council). And still, when judging it one must take into account the positive sides as well. As is known, in economics, profit is directly proportional to risk, and without risk there is no great profit. Sometimes it is not right to take the risk, but taking risk is something to be appreciated. It has potential for gain that will not be achieved otherwise. Many of us—alumni and others—owe thanks to this bold experiment, even if, in a broader view, it failed or at least lacked justification.
Conclusion
I think the judgment of what the film describes is very complex and, of course, influenced by biases and conditioning—by sentiments, by love or hatred, and the like. It is certainly influenced by visual biases (the force of graphic scenes). In practice, it is a very complex matter, and it deserves a judgment that is likewise complex. There are lights and shadows here, and I am trying—despite the sentiments that I too have—to judge matters as balanced as possible. Not only because I have sentiment for the people and the place, but because that is proper. The “tut-tutting” at the sight of the film is natural and easy and seemingly entirely correct. These are indeed acts of horror, and in some cases they had severe consequences. And still, we should not be captivated by a shallow, initial gaze.
It is hard for me to ignore my anarchistic temperament (which is probably not unrelated to my experiences at the Midrashiyah), and it is quite clear to me that this is part of my indulgent attitude toward these appalling phenomena. But I think anarchism has positive sides even from the perspective of those who are not anarchists. It is worth thinking about it from time to time a bit more sympathetically, even if one ultimately decides to reject it. And certainly perspective never harmed anyone. Ben-Gurion was a dictator who perpetrated atrocities, but it is doubtful whether without that temperament and conduct we would have a state today. This does not mean I will justify his every act, but my judgment of him must be complex.
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The interesting thing is that Netiv Meir, despite all the differences, followed a fairly similar path. Rabbi Bina was a great personality in his own right - a scholar, a pioneer, a fighter in the brigade who pushed the students as high as possible, but in the 1980s the place gradually lost control. The students started to get more and more wild and Rabbi Bina was unable to control them. Then they decided to bring in Kopolovich (from the midrash, I think), who was none of these things but was known as a compromise between blacks and whites (they called him Karmbo) and an expert in discipline. Then it turned out that something else was hiding behind the discipline and the ship sank. His methods succeeded in bringing discipline to Netiv Meir, but it turned out that he also used them to obtain favors of his own (in a side note, this suddenly reminded me of Rabbi Avraham Stav's column about Moses striking the rock: https://www.inn.co.il/news/605405).
There was something in the 1980s that caused the classic model of the high school yeshiva to spin out of control and crash. Was it the fall of the yeshivahs of morality that were the intellectual home front of those unique yeshivah heads (Rabbi Yagel of Boroduk, Rabbi Bina of Slobodka, Rabbi Avraham Zuckerman in Kfar Haro”a, and more), or was it the introduction of television into national religious houses that caused students to lose all control?
This is a fascinating sociological question that I don’t think we have a good answer to yet. All that is left is a faltering educational system that fails to reach the heights that the high school yeshivahs reached until the 1980s.
Regarding the high school yeshiva records, I think you are exaggerating.
To the best of my knowledge, Rabbi Yagel did not study in Novhardok, but in Kletzk (under Rabbi Aharon Kotler, with whom he was in contact even after the establishment of the midrashiya).
I believe that the level of Gemara study at the end of high school yeshiva is lower than it was then.
It's possible. But there's a long way to go from here to impressive records and achievements.
Perhaps the expression is exaggerated. What can be said is that until the 1980s, there was a match between the expectations of the students and the expectations of the system, including the Midrashiya. Even if not all institutions operated in the same way, it was still clear what the point of a high school yeshiva was and what they wanted to achieve (studying Torah with an emphasis on Gemara on the one hand and a good matriculation certificate on the other).
Since the 1980s, this has converged less and this has been reflected in the collapse of high school yeshivahs such as Nativ Meir, the Midrashiya, Nahalim, and more. So what has happened since then? Is it because white yeshivahs have entered yeshivahs instead of the haredi yeshivahs that existed until that time? Or is it because of television? The matriculation in Gemara? The disappearance of the Mosar movement? Or all of the answers together? What happened?
There are several factors, but the main one in my opinion is that this method is fundamentally wrong for the general public. It is not clear how anyone thought that studying until the evening, including half a day of Gemara, should be the default for a religious student.
In this context, I will mention what I once wrote here about my father who became the principal of the technological school at Bar Ilan. He saw that Yiddishkeit was lacking and, to my astonishment, decided to reduce the weekly Gemara hours. He explained to me that if people hate Gemara, adding hours will only harm them. It is better for them to study one hour in good taste than six in bad taste. In the long run, this will bring more Torah and more Yiddishkeit.
The yeshivot of morality in their image were closed at the beginning of the days of the midrash and other high schools.
You may be referring to their graduates.
As for the reason – I, like you, also bet on television as a catalyst for deterioration (in my second incarnation as a kind of “visitor” at the Mechina Midrashiya in Kfar Saba (around the time the Midrashiya was closed), the eyes of the staff there would see and resist the influence of the Internet (and the cellular Internet, which was then in its infancy, and was starting to be accessible even to feminists) on the students.
[I have the desire to look back romantically and say that if it had continued, perhaps the Midrashist vandalism would have been a way of ‘living life’ and television/Internet would have spoken to them less. But after all, it was probably just the same anarchy, only with documentation and uploading to TikTok…]
The yeshivot of the Mussar were alive and kicking in the 1940s and 1950s. It was no longer Novorodok, but it was still alive and well. The one who actually dismantled the Mussar movement was the Chazon Ish with his argument about the influence of the local people that forces people to flee to the deserts, i.e. the yeshivot. This argument was directed against intervention in Zionist society, but it was destructive to the Mussar movement because it presented the sociological as prevailing over the psychological, and thus effectively dismantled the basic premise of the Mussar movement, which came from Rabbi Israel Salanter, that with the help of psychological methods they would be able to stand against the modern world. The only ones who stood up to this argument were Rabbi Kook and Rabbi Ovadia, who gave their own answer to the argument of the Chazon Ish. According to the website owner, the argument of the Chazon Ish is not really an argument, but at the time the people of the Mussar movement did not have a good answer to the Chazon Ish, and they disbanded and disappeared.
Very interesting!
What was the answer of Rabbi Kook and Rabbi Ovadia?
According to Rabbi Kook, the foundation of the Jewish people is in the Holy Land (including the return of the Jewish people to the Land of Israel), and therefore it is not the secular who define the place, but the religious who define the place. The secular succeeded because the religious were too exiled and failed to meet the challenge of returning to the Land in a material sense, but ultimately the fact that the Jewish people are founded in the Holy Land means that those who should be troubled by their fellow citizens are the secular from the religious and not the religious from the secular. By the way, Yoram Kaniuk's book of 1988 embodies a similar concept. Yoram Kaniuk is completely secular, but he takes the trouble to mention the religious with the Bible, which gives religious significance to the battles of the Palmach's breakthrough into Jerusalem in 1988, in which Kaniuk participated. He describes how he encountered the verse "In your blood I am alive" during the battles, and in my opinion, this is also the motto of the book. Ultimately, the secular effort in the war derives its meaning from religion, not vice versa.
Rabbi Ovadia gives a different answer. The Land of Israel is the place of the Maimonides and his successors, Maran Beit Yosef and Rabbi Ovadia himself. He who follows the path of the Maimonides and the Beit Yosef is in the right place and is therefore not threatened by secularism. The only ones who are threatened by secularism are the Ashkenazim who follow the Tosafot, even though the origin of the Tosafot is Ashkenazi and not the Land of Israel, and therefore they have to hide in yeshivas to avoid being initiated. On the other hand, if they had followed the Rambam's method, they would not have had to fear secularism. Rabbi Mazuz provided proof for this method that the Land of Israel is the Rambam's place from the blessing request for Hillel on Rosh Chodesh, which the Rambam and the Rambam apparently disagree on (according to the Rambam, an individual does not bless, but the congregation does, and according to the Rambam, no one blesses), and yet the House of Yosef ruled in favor of the Rambam and did not rule two against one - the Rambam and the Rambam against the Rambam, because the Land of Israel is the Rambam's place.
14: Did Rabbi Ovadia address this question and give this answer, or is it the product of your personal research or someone else's?
My personal research. Rabbi Kook also did not address the problem of the Jewish vision directly (Rabbi Kook died in 1935). But sometimes it is interesting to think about the issue from this angle.
The transition at Netiv Meir from Rabbi Bina to Koplovitz (Shari) did not stem from the spirit of the times but from a more prosaic reason - Rabbi Bina was getting old and weak (by the mid-1980s he already had a personal therapist).
It is not clear what kind of loss of control there was at Netiv Meir in the 1980s - the best nerds still studied there and the wildest act of condus was stealing shoes from a competing class in the month of Adar.
The disintegration of Netiv Meir occurred because of the atrocities of Koplovitz (Shari) and the turning a blind eye of the educational staff who should have understood what was happening at home.
In my humble opinion, the education in obedience and respect for the rabbis that was instilled in the students at Netiv Meir was detrimental to them.
Perhaps if one-sixtieth of the spirit of rebellion of the Midrashiya had existed at Netiv Meir, the students would have been able to stop the atrocities and simply say no!
By the way, Kopolovich was previously in the midrashiya. I don't know if he also committed his crimes there, but it's safe to say that a messenger is doing his mission. Still, I haven't heard of the big rebels there who came out against him. First of all, you don't always hear and you don't always believe. Beyond that, it's hard to judge teenagers for what they do in such a situation. It's a very unfamiliar situation, certainly for a religious teenager, and he doesn't really understand what it means (the film also had a heartbreaking interview with Hagai Rusnak, who was sexually abused in the midrashiya).
To the best of my knowledge, in Koplovits' first 4-5 years at Netiv Meir, he did not commit any overt sexual assault.
He needed time to establish his authority in the yeshiva before he could operate without interference.
So it is likely that the students of the midrash were not abused by him.
There was a point when a group of Netiv Meir graduates went to Rabbi Druckman to complain about the same man.
Rabbi Druckman ordered them to remain silent in order to prevent blasphemy.
What is the point of blasphemy if one rabbi sinned?
The problem is not the only criminal, but there were dozens of students who were harmed by him over a whole decade and no one stood up to stop him or went to complain in real time.
The only ones who mustered the courage to complain did so from a distance after finishing their studies and after military service.
The silence of the sheep on Netiv Meir is blasphemy because it showed that the best education in the religious sector creates a flock of sheep that will obey any instruction given by an authoritative man with an old beard.
And this is what Rabbi Druckman wanted to hide
Teenagers are teenagers, and they can't really live alone and manage themselves without adults to support, teach, and nurture them. The kibbutzim discovered this, the boarding schools discovered this. Don't blame the students of Nativ Meir for not resisting Harb Kopolovich, Ezra Landrover easily seduced the boys of all the high school yeshivas in the country, and also some haredi boys, many Bedouin boys, and Nepalese street children.
My fellow Midrashia graduates
Tal Bachar is right
But!!!!! Tal Bachar is a despicable person
All the acts he describes did indeed occur in recent years
All the acts committed are criminal in every respect
Each generation of Dalits wanted to show that they are superior to their predecessors
The one who is clearly guilty of this is Rabbi Yogel, the late, who failed to stop and prevent the criminal acts
But Tal, you are despicable
Not everything needs to be brought out and published to the whole world
You did not give the right to respond to those you slander, Rabbi Yogel, the late, and Israel Sadan, the late
All the discussions you Midrashia graduates are having are internal discussions
There is no justification for the graduates' success in civilian life for these acts
Zvika Malik-Machzor
Zvika, your protest has been recorded. In the next film, I'm sure he'll conjure up Rabbi Yagel and Sadan to give them the right to respond.
And in essence, if you also agree that everything is true, then why do you lack the right to respond so much? If they had responded, they would have denied this truth? What would have changed? By the way, in the years when the speaker was Rabbi Yagel was no longer there, and the yeshiva heads who served at the time (Margalit and Bloch) were interviewed and only supported the things described.
And as for getting things out into the open, I'm completely in favor. As the saying goes: sunlight is the best disinfectant. It sparks a discussion that is very good that it has arisen, and it is a fact that this would not have happened without it.
By the way, I hope you sent this message to Tal to give him the right to respond.
I think it's worth getting out of nostalgia and giving up the resentment about the damage to the name of the midrashiya. This film is balanced and reflective and has only done it and us good.
Rabbi Koplowitz was brought in as a discipline expert? Where did that come from? I was there when he was brought in (I was an instructor). He was a weak man, who stood up neither to the students nor to the administration. He gained power over the years like any administrator, but he did not achieve discipline except at the cost of flattering the students. Oh, and Rabbi Bina came from a convert, not from Slobodka
Sometimes weak people turn out to have methods that seemingly strong people do not have. His method of using his associates, called Kopo boys, to break up the cyclical formation and thus achieve discipline was very effective. He gave them benefits and in return they prevented the cyclical drift to destructive places. Only after a while did they realize that this was a honey trap where he expected more from them than these goals.
Out of interest, is the rabbi familiar with democratic schools? Or has he studied the democratic education system?
Also, what he calls “true democracy”, as opposed to ”democratic game”, is not democracy, as a form of political government. It is tribal majority rule. A tribal assembly is held, the tribal chief (who is probably the strongest warrior) proposes a proposal, the majority decides, whether it is to migrate north or south or to execute a thief or to kill all the redheads or all the witches. This is even more ancient and primitive than a monarchy, the king at least rules a complex kingdom with a nobility that decentralizes powers and splits into smaller estates. A tribal council is the most ancient, primary and primitive. There is no justice there, there is who is the strongest and who will get the majority to support him.
It is very strange to claim that the elite of the sector thinks, according to the article, that ”true democracy” is just tribal majority rule with no limits, but it has nothing to do with the hill boys. As if the wall mosses don't look at the cedars and learn from them… or try to be like them… or exaggerate what the cedars say more politely…
Poor. Shallow. Probably extra-Orthodox.
It is said that someone came to the Hazon Ish for advice. He said that the community rabbi had gone abroad and was asked to replace the rabbi and give a lesson between Mincha and Ariva. That sweet-mouthed man was there, the homeowners sat spellbound every day and didn't want the lesson to end…
In the meantime, the rabbi returned from abroad and returned to give the lesson.
The homeowners returned to catch up on sleep…
Now the “replacement rabbi” came to the Hazon Ish to ask if it was appropriate for him to give a separate lesson to the homeowners so that they would return home with another piece of Torah.
Or should we feel that the regular rabbi would be offended?
The Hazon Ish asked him if he was paid for the lesson. Is there a “earnings” in this? The rabbi replied “Nothing, nothing, nothing. It's only for the sake of heaven”.
The Chazon Ish replied to him - If it is for the sake of heaven, flee from it like fire.
Although this is not the Rabbi's way, I will add “And be careful with the embers lest you get burned”.
A massive portion of the money that Michi has made in this life is public money (academic institutions are funded by the state).
You are more than welcome to point out Michi's substantial contributions to the world of Judaism and the world of physics, after so many fat salaries (and pensions, training, gifts, meals, benefits, etc.) Michi received for decades while in academia.
And no, teaching courses to undergraduate physics students, writing insignificant articles that no one really looks at, and writing all kinds of nonsense and doodles on the blog here, or teaching insignificant courses (Torah study) in Judaism, that doesn't count.
It's not worth what the state invested in it.
A free food parasite is what Michi is.
Hi
Thanks for the detailed and in-depth article.
**** Personal and unreasoned comment. In my opinion also incorrect. Deleted by (M”A)****
What is a Midrashist? Now I have a few things clear to me. The scenes of violence and vandalism in the film are shocking (I always knew that Midrashists were "wild", but I didn't know how far things would go). But most of all I was shocked by the scene in which the "educational counselor" (Aalek) is seen mocking a student who came to complain to her about the humiliation and violence he had experienced. The almost official support for sadism (including the sadistic "sevens") and the mockery of our fellow human beings reminded me of things I read many years ago about German boarding school more than a century ago, and I will stop here and leave it at that.
The scene "Aalek" that you watched was a scene from the video "The Coronation".
But on second thought, what's the point of mentioning it? After all, we've only recently seen how conclusions are drawn from the Coronation films (e.g. the blackface from the Horev Academy, and some say, etc.).
Mordechai, you didn't understand the context. She wasn't mocking him at all. This is a video initiated in collaboration with him.
A reader of Rabbi Dr. Michael Avraham's blog didn't realize he was being used in a film. Draw your own conclusions.
I accept (although I don't remember it being mentioned in the film, maybe I missed it). But the question is, does the staged scene reflect reality (even if exaggerated and inflated)? To the best of my knowledge, the "sevens" are completely authentic, and they express a sick sadism that received approval, at least tacitly, from management, and therefore even if this specific scene is staged, I am still firm in my opinion that the more repulsive and shocking the vandalism scenes are, the more shocking the sadism is.
And let me tell you, I myself am a graduate of the “Perchi Aharon” high school yeshiva in Kiryat Shmuel. Another religious Zionist “flagship”. (One of its famous graduates is ”Rabbi” Yona Metzger…). I remember that every time the Midrash or Rabbi Yagel was mentioned in the presence of the Rosh Yeshiva, Rabbi Baruch Edelstein zt”l, he would quickly divert the conversation to another subject while failing to hide his embarrassment. So we didn't understand why.
It was not written and does not need to be written. Every sensible person understands this for himself.
The oaths were usually not morbid. Sometimes a little wild and sometimes not even that. Of course, sometimes they deviate from good taste, as children do. This is another example of the outside judgment of someone who does not understand.
If the Yeshivah Parochei Aharon is also a flagship, then we have really come a long way. You made me remember Rabbi Edelstein recycling in our ears with great pleasure Leibowitz's bland joke about soccer players (give them 21 more balls, etc.).
And yet, does this scene reflect reality? Was there a sadistic atmosphere in the institution? That is the question, not whether or not it was written that the scene was staged.
If the scene is disconnected from the daily life in the institution, then this is such a wild slander that it is hard to believe why the counselor collaborated with it. But I was not a Medrashist (B&H) and therefore I cannot judge. To the extent that the scene is somehow related to reality, sadism towards humans is always worse than vandalism towards trees and stones.
Rabbi Edelstein, may God bless him and grant him peace, was a great man and a Jew with a great soul and a lot of love for everyone. But I definitely agree that he was not suited to his role, nor to the one he filled after his retirement, and not because of his humor. (Which he had none at all, in my opinion).
For a change (and for what I think is the first time) I endorse every word in R’ Michi's article.
My take on the film, as a graduate of the Midrash, is that every second of it is accurate.
Including what was noted above about the criticisms that were written that ”here we see the roots of the settler violence”, which is so far-fetched, since (from my acquaintance with the cycles around me) the product of the Midrash (and as implied in the article) is divided into 3: religious bourgeoisie (Gv”sh and Ra”anana's version), secularists, and a handful of Haredim who were burned (in the earlier cycles – more, I think, and in the later cycles – less).
*
Another side note about something else that was said (in the film itself) that someone there said that he was “a “suppressed” For not including girls in the midrashiya, and that this is what led to anarchism.
To me, on the contrary, it is true that the absence of girls may have been the core of anarchism, but since we are aware that it was inherent (to some extent, as in the article) in the institution itself, it was better that there were no girls there, since who will straighten out its fate? In this sense of comparing the midrashiya to a "balloon", the experience should be compared to a kibbutz, and if we stray too far (not so far, considering that the midrashiya itself was founded before the establishment of the state) to the wild nature of the Palmach (as described in books that dare to criticize it), the result should have been disastrous, and it is good that the founders did not break this religious taboo of a yeshiva-without-girls.
[In a sidebar, and from a more “Dossi” perspective: As someone who later, by nature of his occupation, came into contact with students at the Midrashiya's subsidiary institution, in Kfar Saba, which has always been considered more ”calmer” and ”paler” compared to the Midrashiya in Pardes Hanna (even after it was closed), it was there that there were stories (not necessarily serious from a moral perspective, but certainly from a religious perspective) with girls, etc.]
I actually think that the girls could have had a moderating effect. That's pretty clear to me. That doesn't mean that the absence of girls is the cause of the mess, but their presence would have moderated it. But none of this is to recommend a mixed yeshiva boarding school. It's a valid comment in itself, without leading to a practical conclusion (for other reasons).
The phenomenon of the Haredi teachers, in my opinion, stemmed from the perception that they knew how to teach Gemara better, you emphasized the advantage of this, that there was no ideological significance. Of course, this also came at the cost of internal contradictions, of some of our members becoming Haredi and going to black yeshivahs, without enlisting, in a way that harmed the declared ideology of the Mizrahi Youth Seminary (Noah). But the phenomenon of the Haredi educator for a religious Zionist public was very widespread then, in our generation, in yeshivahs and ulpans, and in your opinion it should have produced the individualism in question, but that is not what happened. As we also know, in our Ulpana in Kfar Pines during those years, the prominent figure was Rabbi Beharan, who came from a Haredi Jerusalem background, and as noted above by one of the commenters, again, like the other high school yeshivas (except for Ulpana Amana in Kfar Saba), there was a background and emphasis on the Mussar movement. Of course, it had its problems, but it really had an advantage for its Haredi, who balanced the influx after Gush Emunim and Rabbi Kook. Most of the Ulpana students admired Hanan Porat, a fellow student of Kfar Pines, who would come quite a bit to give lessons and talks to whoever wanted them. Rabbi Beharan always made sure to cool ideological fashion, to show the opposite pole, and to remind us not to get excited about him or anything else. (He took us to demonstrations against Kissinger, but also to the opera at the Tel Aviv Opera House, but that's a topic for another discussion, I guess.)
Well, comparing it to the Ulpana is really absurd. With girls it works differently. In other institutions there were Haredi educators, but it's not true that ideology wasn't present there. Either Haredi or otherwise. Their presence was the result of coercion. In the midrashiya, not. Therefore, in the midrashiya, in my opinion, ideology wasn't present at all.
You wrote, "Without the Midrashiya, most of us would have passed our matriculation exams... without throwing burning cars off the roof, without breaking limbs and paralyzing teenagers, and without killing several children by drowning" - and you prove for yourself why the film is false to the truth. You can't take scenes that the creator admitted were completely staged, of course put only them in all the promos for the film, in addition to the closely related news introduction of the "settler terror" and think that people who have no idea will get a complex view of the institution and not - "Here is the root of the troubles for our entire country". Why wasn't Bachar able to find difficult plays from his year? Lack of money? Of course, the budget he received was very clear to him what product he needed to achieve. [And a phone call that someone who doesn't want to bring material that will get dirty? Don't worry, the other friend brought exactly the same material, and we only profited by the viewers thinking it was more shocking.]
(It doesn't contradict the fact that there was a drowning after graduation and a person jumped from the roof and became paralyzed, not how you phrased it at all).
-You wrote beautifully about the success of the institution, but it's really incomprehensible to the viewer, even without the terrible imbalance.
-Acceptance to the institution in the past years, from what I've heard, was indeed difficult.
-You wrote about the consolidation, but the viewer doesn't understand at all what the benefit of that consolidation is, other than pleasant company!
-Ideology: Since the time of Rabbi Bloch, there has been a change, a rabbi who tells his students that he read the Hador article and everything is nonsense is different from your experience. (And on the other hand, the young rabbis who came from the Rabbi Center also had an influence,) and perhaps this is a much more important point than all the other reasons for the dramatic change in the institution.
– When I went to a week of yeshiva at the Merkaz HaRav yeshiva, I was received by the rabbis with royal honors (and of course there was no need for an admissions interview), that sounds different from your experiences, especially since I saw the outstanding students from the midrash there.
The lessons of Rabbi Bloch and of course Rabbi Yogel were at a higher level than most Zionist yeshiva. Of course, in the twilight, learning depended on desire.
And this is the time to ask - did you not find a single local graduate rabbi to interview? Didn't you hear about the educational experiences of Rabbi Elisha Wislitsky when he was on the Machzor committee? Didn't you see Rabbi Ariel Edri hanging out with his Machzor classmates at a meeting? Are there no important rabbis, dayanim and yeshivot heads?
(The Rosh Yeshiva Shavei Hebron from the line of ’Ku’ This is an interesting anecdote for Zion when he disagreed with his rabbi Rabbi Zvi Tau when he supported Bennett and regretted it later)
You expect a film to be a research paper. It's irrelevant. And even if one scene was staged, it doesn't change the essence (although I didn't know it was staged). When I write that there would be no deaths or burning of cars, the intention is clear.
Rabbi Bloch's claim about the Hador article is completely legitimate. Why does that mean he has some kind of problem? Because he thinks differently than you? This honesty is very educational, unlike the fixation of ideologues.
They don't stage and call it a documentary, and it's really not about one scene but about the main scenes.
I didn't claim that he shouldn't try to educate, even though cynicism like "how was your spiritual awakening this morning" in my opinion didn't contribute to his educational success, in addition to the fact that he really opposed any kind of freedom. – I wrote this in response to your writing that there was no ideology.
Also note that in the film, Rabbi Bloch even dares to claim that Rabbi Yougel didn't have an educational path, if you deleted a similar comment about him from the blog, of course in the film you would probably have removed it.
I would also add that you started by saying "all sides are very adamant", and indeed the many comments "here is the exposure of the source of evil in the country" Be firm, but it is precisely the Midrashists who are not afraid to admit the negative aspects, and yet they are the ones who are attacked for their “lack of acceptance of the narrative” when it is based on deception and even lies.
If you could also address the rest of my first arguments above, I would appreciate it.
Hello.
You are talking about things you understand nothing about. I don't understand much about documentary either, but I did some research and was told that it is common to add atmospheric scenes where authentic material is lacking. The question of why authentic materials were not presented again indicates a lack of understanding (and/or apologetic bias). There were not always materials, and they did not always survive, and they were not always made available to the director, and he did not always know about them. The question is whether the scene reflects reality. Unequivocally yes. In this case, I understood that there was also a real case of a car being lifted onto the roof (of English teacher Harris), and therefore it is completely legitimate.
This reminds me of the constant claims of biblical critics that we did not find any bastions of the Israelites in the Sinai Desert or of Abraham in Canaan, and therefore they probably did not exist. I allow myself to assume that your response to those criticisms was slightly different in direction from what you wrote here.
Your comment about my statement that there were no cars being thrown off the roof reflects the same lack of understanding. I am using the materials in the film to make a claim, and you are (unjustly) taking issue with the word I used. In light of what I explained above, the taking issue is also incorrect, but the taking issue itself is a lack of understanding.
Your comparison between Rabbi Bloch's statement and your deleted statement is ridiculous. But I will not delete it. It is permissible to be ridiculous. It is forbidden to defame without justification.
The two examples you gave (Etrog Wischlitzky) are examples of contradiction. This is a negligible minority in the second-tier leadership, with no real connection to the line, and one of them even had Midrashite rebellions (which were suppressed, as the line did). But I really am not interested in getting into these stupid polemics. I am talking about a phenomenon and you are giving me a weak and esoteric example on the other hand.
I did not find any additional argument in your words that merits consideration. I have exhausted everything.
I consider you a genius and therefore I did not understand why you responded personally after you took my words to other realms than what I wrote.
-“Your deleted response”, I did not write any defamatory response that was deleted..
-Your reference to the ’line’, I did not write about myself that I am from the ’line’ or tried to prove that the Midrashists control the ’line’ yeshiva, to the best of my knowledge the Merkaz HaRav yeshiva is not really in the ’line’.
– Manipulative presentation of staged materials, although like me and you I do not have a great understanding of the document but most viewers, at least the religious ones, do not understand and are mistaken in thinking that it is original. As a religious person I do not find permission for this. (Even if you try to claim that this fits with the narrative).
You are also invited to listen to some of the comments here. Minute 35, for example, there is an expansion on the emphasis on the story of one sexual assault that they managed to find from 60 years of the institution.
https://radio.neurim.org.il/podcast/%d7%94%d7%96%d7%a8%d7%a7%d7%95%d7%a8-27-6-23/
Interesting to read.
By the way, I noticed that except for one scene in the film, there are no incidents of abuse and bullying, which is the first thing you expect to see in a place like this. Did the consolidation of the Midrashists prevent this or is it simply not expressed enough in the film?
I wondered about that too. From my impression, there was no abuse of the weak. I guess social obligation didn't allow it. As for sexual scenes, I haven't heard of any cases, but naturally these are hidden matters and it's hard to know.
Both abuse and gender relations (should we call it that?) were addressed in the film. Regarding abuse, one of the adults who refused to participate in the film was voiced as “Oh, yeah, that one, there was also someone who didn’t have fun, we decided he was the thief, laughs.” He casually describes severe abuses such as students who beat him for four years, boycotts, and students who urinated on his bed.
On the sexual issue, the film claims that the filmmaker’s peers were so deeply immersed in the group experience that they were not interested in girls, neither in the seminaries nor outside of them, and in fact did not go through sexual and romantic puberty at all, at least not in their teenage years. Monks to glory. I think the problem with the absence of women in their lives was not that women would have refined them, but that they simply did not experience normal sexual and emotional maturation at the age when they are supposed to experience it gradually and will have to quickly fill in the gaps before marriage at the age of 22-24. Again, in the movie version only.
About the fact that they came out normal and non-violent later in life? First of all, some of them joined the army, which unfortunately has violent and forceful parts (among the soldiers and officers) that it cannot eradicate from it, so great wisdom is not and above all does not indicate anything, one way or the other.
But I will tell you a secret - even war criminals, unlike a thousand and thousands of deviants, who were dragged along with their friends in an atmosphere where there are no laws and no people in an enemy country to commit cruel crimes against innocent people, will return to being “normative” upon their return to citizenship and most of them will not murder anyone again (yes, even Arab soldiers). It's a fascinating phenomenon, how a person disconnects themselves from the crowd. The question will always be asked, do we as a society care about the victims or only the criminals? If the criminals, apart from their crimes, are useful and wealthy citizens, everything is okay?
“He refused to participate in the film”, come on.. Did you think that a man from the Midrashiya who was caught red-handed stealing from his close friends would come and tell you how much he stole and what he did with all the money?!
This is the director's way of bringing you the story. And along the way, letting him invent a “tradition of finding a thief”.
“By the way, he exposed the abuses of 4 years” Are you kidding? He neither refused nor exposed, he left the institution on the spot (when he realized his dire situation and in conjunction with the actions of a few isolated guys). There is no justification for this, but enough distortion. (By the way, it is usually about 3 years).
Regarding your words about war criminals, of course there is no need to respond, I agree with the reasons why so many people, from the Midrashiya and outside, believe that the film is inappropriate.
Do you really know the story and know that it's not as she screamed?
This simply puts a damper on the talk about "solidification" being so significant and serious when there are such casualties.
The director admitted that this is the story
Not only is it not the first thing you expect, you don't expect it at all.
And that's why it wasn't. It's as simple as that.
I was at the premiere of the film.
For the first two weeks, like many graduates, I felt terrible.
I was very angry about the director's basic lack of integrity, the distortion of reality, the tendency to intentionally emphasize evil.
I also used the phrases "This is not the midrashiya I knew, it's just the 10th cycle and above, with us it really wasn't like this and that and that."
After two weeks, I fell for the shuki - the token in favor of those who didn't study in the midrashiya.
.
The guy is no less than a genius at marketing.
He taught us how to do marketing, how to take a nice plus product and turn it into something that half the country is talking about.
He opened the instruction book of marketing in the modern era, and didn't skip a single paragraph.
First of all, he found a "sacred cow" that is very important to a lot of people.
If you ask a Midrash graduate what place influenced him the most in his life, where he understood the meaning of the value of friendship, he will answer you the Midrash.
Ask him what period of his life he enjoyed the most, and he will probably answer you that it was the Midrash.
If you ask a Midrash graduate what he thinks of Rabbi Yuval Zechariah? He will answer that the man was a giant, a genius in Torah, an educator who was ahead of his time, a man who influenced religious Zionism more than anyone else. He will also tell you about an educator who loved his student with all his heart and will continue and continue.
He took the brand “Midrashit Noam” with all its significance, the sacred cow below, and decided to slaughter it, burn the body, and hang what was left in the center of the city.
He mixed physical violence and sick vandalism with Kristallnacht and its historical significance.
Dark desires of sexual harassment, with abuse of a classmate who did not forgive.
Abuse of the weak (in words or less) with deep contempt for educators and deceivers.
He told of the contempt and disdain that the students felt for the instructors.
My father, the late Haim, was an instructor in the midrashiya for years.
I was and still am very proud of the fact that he was an instructor in the midrashiya. Graduates appreciated and loved him very much. They loved him and the midrashiya. When I met graduates who were his students, they always told me what a special instructor he was, they certainly did not disrespect him.
My father was not the only instructor who thought good things about him.
Youthful memories of walking on the edge with students drowning.
Pictures of a student smashing a car in a fit of rage and burning cars being thrown from the roof and crashing with an amazing Purim presentation project.
A bit of a Sheba patrol and uniforms with exploding hormones and girls.
Take all of these, mix them together hard, cook on low heat, create anticipation and there you have it, there you have it, there you have it.
This is how you transform from a relatively unknown director and creator, to one who appears in prime time
on television, in articles in Haaretz and Makor Rishon, and is a central topic of conversation in alumni WhatsApp groups, at the Shulchan Shabbat, and in synagogue.
When are you, my dear, one of the best marketing and branding people in the country. Take this case study and do a course on it, write a book about it, it will surely be a bestseller.
Well done, dear director, you succeeded, you became famous, now you are a celebrity, it's just a shame that you did all this work at the expense of us, the graduates of the Midrashiya.
Accurate stuff. I'm in the 21st grade and I told my kids I was ashamed of the movie.
I knew Dad, and I remember him very fondly as a guide.
I like what is written and the analysis. There are two additional explanations that were not written (which may explain something but certainly not everything):
1. The preparatory school in Kfar Saba was an institution with very strong discipline and no respect for students. It seems logical to me that in the years it existed, it influenced the breaking of boundaries in its midrash.
2. The fact that there is an ideological/religious gap between the rabbis who were Haredi (eventually Mustard) and the students may also have had an impact. Students could not see the rabbis as a figure they could trust and follow. Rabbi Yogel is a bit of an exception - because he is from a different generation and is not connected to this politics.
As a bystander, and as a reader of the reviews here and there, I really had no way to decide. Until I found, to my amazement, that most of the archive materials are simply on YouTube, for anyone to see, and in their full shredding. So first, this is a certificate of poverty for research. Second, out of immense curiosity, I started watching dozens of YouTube videos uploaded by students and alumni, without face blurring and without cutting sections, and I was amazed by the gap.
For example, there is a scene in the film that is shown several times and it looks as if the synagogue is on fire and fireworks are flying into the sky. In the full film, you see that this is part of the joy of Purim. The guys light fireworks on the roof and then they all run into the synagogue to dance in circles. Because of the poor quality of the recording and photography at night, the frame is burned and this creates the illusion that the roof is on fire and there is also a fire inside the synagogue. In addition, the frame is cut after the fireworks go off and you hear the roar of running. The connection between a burning beit midrash, students running and screaming – makes a horrifying impression. If he had left up to 20 seconds of footage, we would have seen the classic sight of yeshiva boys dancing and dancing in a circle for a long time, like nerdy yeshiva boys. The gap between the somewhat naive dance circles and fireworks, and the appearance in the film – is unfair. And this is a recurring pattern. There is hardly a single moment of sanity in the film, of students learning, of a rabbi delivering a sermon (except for small prayer segments that can also be found online at length). A sane appearance of a yeshiva.
In general, when you see full-length documentaries on ”vandalism”, it turns out that it is usually part of Hanukkah and Purim events – which yeshiva doesn't have these? – and sometimes there is also an audience of hundreds of spectators accompanied by security personnel and the like. Absolutely not as it is perceived in the film. It is clear that the director chose specific segments with a cinematic purpose (at best) and less of a documentary one.
In addition, the film's theme is very superficial. There is no in-depth analysis of the reasons for the fall, and from a plot point of view, there is no explanation for the meteoric rise. Things are said that describe the great ambitions of the founders, but ambitions do not produce successes. Of the fall, it is also said over and over again that the lack of rules got out of control. But there is no explanation of how it was under control for so many years. And I am talking about a somewhat in-depth explanation, perhaps from an external expert interviewee and not just from yeshiva graduates, and not just statements that are probably quite understandable to yeshiva graduates.
In short, the film is an internal product of yeshiva interviewees with a yeshiva graduate director, and perhaps this is the director's way of continuing the inflated tradition, or of making up for a feeling of lack after two decades, of wildly surpassing everything that came before him. Beyond the successful vandalism that the director did, there are holes in all other aspects:
From a documentary perspective, he composed video clips in a way that does not reflect reality at all (as mentioned, check out YouTube).
From a plot perspective, the connection between the rise and the fall is unclear. What was the initial strength of the vandalistic yeshiva? What was the secret of its charm? Why are its graduates so attached to it and most of them unwilling to give it a bad name? Repeating the word “solidification” many times does not provide an explanation. It is clear that the management has a place in this ”solidification” and it is not clear how it did it with such great success (yes, Rabbi Yugel. A little more explanation would not hurt).
In terms of the theme, it is not clear what the rupture was and what caused it. As mentioned, there are statements by the interviewees, but there are no causal statements that make enough sense at a reasonable level (not to mention an in-depth psycho-sociological investigation). And I'm sure that you can research a lot about what went on there, and you can derive significant insights from it, but the naive viewer (like me), when shown testosterone-fueled boys, yeshiva and religion, young age, hormones, shattering glass, burning buildings and a disgruntled crew member - and all this on loops and with excellent cinematic music - the connection becomes superficial and natural: aggressive youthful exuberance, which we all know in a small way from our own lives, when we were young, or from our young children, which everyone does at certain ages and at certain times. But this seemingly misses the midrash. There seems to have been something special and less instinctive there, and that's a shame.
Very nice article. Thank you.
It seemed to me in the film that there were too many graduates without kippahs?
Is this true? Is it related to the midrash or in general to the dropout rate in the religious community?
First of all, an important principle in critical viewing: when you see a few people, there is no need to assume that it is a representative sample. This is the director's choice. Even if it is made for reasons relevant to the film (for example, that he believes these are the people with the information or with the interesting statements), it still does not necessarily represent the graduates as a whole.
Secondly, there is indeed quite a bit of secularization. In our time, as far as I know, secularization in the midrashiya was at a significantly higher percentage than in other high school yeshivahs (and also the Haredim). I do not know what the situation was in the last years of the existence of the midrashiya. It is clear that there is also a dropout in the religious community as a whole, and at least its overt aspects are on a larger scale than among the Haredim. I do not understand the question, after all, this is a simple and well-known fact, and I have already dealt with it and its implications quite a bit on this site.
You wrote, "Ben Gurion was a dictator who committed atrocities." What atrocities do you mean?
Altalena. Persecution of Etzel and Lehi members and denial of work and health services. Wiretapping and use of the institution for political purposes. Missing?
There were rebels in the kingdom.
There was no kingdom that could be rebelled against (at least not in the halakhic sense). The weapons were intended to be distributed to the Jerusalemites (there was no IDF in Jerusalem yet) according to an agreement between Begin and Ben-Gurion, which Ben-Gurion violated. Of course, there is also the question of whether Ben-Gurion had ulterior motives when he shot at the Altalena, for example those related to Begin.
Rebels in the kingdom precisely in the halakhic sense.
Refer to the Laws of Theft and Loss, Chapter 5, Halacha 18:
“What are the things said about a king whose coinage is issued in those lands, since the people of that land agreed upon him and their opinion was that he was their master and they were his slaves.”
Since already at that time the coinage of Ben Gurion's rule was accepted as a negotiable coin (Yannai Spitzer wrote about this recently), then he had the law of a king and the law of a rebel in the kingdom.
So maybe we'll fire cannons at opponents of the reform because they're rebelling against the monarchy?
The pilots who refuse are certainly rebels in the kingdom, but they found a legal loophole to evade the definition by claiming that they are volunteers and not obligated by law. But really, in principle, the kingdom is allowed to kill them as rebels. And in military law there is a concept of a field trial, one of the penalties of which is death.