What Do Providence and Messianism Have to Do with the Judicial Reform? (Column 584)
With God’s help
Disclaimer: This post was translated from Hebrew using AI (ChatGPT 5 Thinking), so there may be inaccuracies or nuances lost. If something seems unclear, please refer to the Hebrew original or contact us for clarification.
The current turmoil in Israel has once again stirred in me somber reflections on the questions of providence and messianism, and I will try to lay them out here.
The Debate About Divine Involvement
More than once I have presented here my view that in our generation it appears that God is not actively involved in the world. Things occur by the way of nature, in accordance with the laws of nature and people’s choices. The conventional religious outlook projects biblical depictions onto our present reality, according to which God is involved in the world to some degree. One can argue that “there is no blade of grass that stirs without an angel over it telling it, ‘Grow’,” meaning that everything that happens depends on the Holy One. There are intermediate views that hold that God is partially involved—for example, that events affecting the Jewish people as a whole, or at least fateful events, are in His hands. The contemporary redemption is a good example, as religious-Zionist views regard the present processes of the ingathering of Zion as the work of God. When the process stalls or regresses (the Disengagement, Oslo), we are told that such is the way of redemption, like the dawn that breaks little by little. There are delays and local reversals, but the direction is clear, deterministic, and irreversible.
I have already pointed out more than once the folly in the notion of “hishtadlut” (the supposed obligation to “do one’s part”), which does not hold water logically, and which even those who swear by it do not truly believe. I argued that it is essentially a cloak for disbelief in divine involvement and providence. It is a kind of mental duality, a phenomenon I discussed in column 199 and in columns 575 – 576. In any case, it seems that the notion of “hishtadlut” drains the belief in providence and divine involvement of any factual content. In practice, those who believe in divine involvement behave like those who do not. This also turns the notion of involvement into an unfalsifiable thesis (for, as we recall, “God doesn’t work for us,” and therefore whenever what is expected does not happen, we have an excellent explanation). As is known, we are forbidden even to put God to the test, so this thesis cannot be subjected to an empirical trial. And even in the one area where testing is permitted—tithing (and perhaps charity)—no one has actually done so, and not for nothing. Without having checked, I surmise that systematic attempts to test it would come up empty. I also suspect that others who do believe in divine involvement do not undertake such trials because, deep down, they know I am right.
Practical Implications
If so, there would ostensibly be no practical implication to the question of divine involvement in the world. There are implications for prayer and petitions to Him, which I have discussed in the past, but not behavioral implications for how we conduct ourselves in the world. Even those who believe in such involvement conduct themselves in practice as if they do not, for there is the “obligation of hishtadlut.” Yet it seems we can nevertheless find practical implications.
There is a well-known story from the beginning of the War of Independence: Rabbi Herzog heard that the Brisker Rav was about to leave Jerusalem and feared a collapse of morale. He went to persuade him not to leave and told him that we have a tradition that the Third Temple will not be destroyed.[1] The Brisker Rav replied: And I have a tradition from my father’s house that when they shoot, one must run. I will not address the validity of inventions that rely on such obscure traditions (like the “tradition” that in the future the halakhah will be decided in accordance with Beit Shammai), though the fact is that many adopt them. In any event, to my mind this story is instructive on several levels.
First, it reflects the difference between religious-Zionist ideology and Haredi pragmatism. But what is more important for our purposes is the implication for the question of “hishtadlut.” The Haredim certainly declare that everything is in God’s hands (except for the founding of the state, which of course is the work of the sitra achra), but when there is shooting, they make sure to run. In other words, their belief in total providence does not contradict the “obligation of hishtadlut,” which empties that belief of content. It reminds me of the notice we received during the Second Gulf War that the small yeshiva where our son studied was about to be closed because of the danger of missiles. We wrote then to the mashgiach that we had naively thought that Torah study protects us all from missiles, but apparently that did not persuade him (if this is “beri heizka”—a clear hazard—I don’t know what isn’t “beri heizka”). In practice, those who declare that everything is in God’s hands conduct themselves like the last of the unbelievers. But that is what we saw above. What is more relevant here is what happens on the religious-Zionist side of the divide. Here we can see a rare practical consequence of belief in divine involvement. Rabbi Herzog in effect proposes not to engage in the hishtadlut that the situation demands, relying on a divine promise that we will not lose the war. That is, his belief in divine involvement led him to adopt a different practical policy. This is a rare case. I assume he would not instruct a private individual in this way (to pray instead of going to a doctor), but his belief in the redemptive process of the people of Israel as a whole was enough to ignore the practical imperative of hishtadlut.
The Current Situation
Amid the stormy debate over the judicial reform, a situation has arisen in which various experts warn of the state’s deterioration—economically, legally, diplomatically, in security terms, and of course socially. Eighty percent of new startups are being incorporated abroad. The shekel’s value is dropping, the stock exchange is plunging, and there are warnings of a credit-rating downgrade. People are moving money and investors are pulling out of investments in Israel. Experts warn that we are on the brink of a severe economic recession. Our foreign relations are in tatters (especially with the United States and the Abraham Accords countries). People are emigrating, and many others are considering it. The army faces a serious readiness crisis and a cohesion crisis. The social rift appears irreparable. And I have not yet mentioned (in my view dubious) warnings of the end of democracy and an emerging dictatorship. These are outcomes that will be very hard to fix, and some of them are already materializing today. These are not merely warnings about the future. The future could, of course, be even worse.
It is important to understand that I do not mean only the reform legislation. I have written more than once that the reform is not the main issue here, but the government’s policy and its considerations. Not a few are now coming to realize this. The ramifications I described are not a direct product of the reform but of this government’s general reckless policy (just yesterday they announced an across-the-board cut in order to transfer another 165 million shekels to the Haredim and the yeshivot).
It is also important to reject the claim that this is the will of the majority and that we must not allow a loud minority to dictate policy and overturn the elections. It is worth looking at the findings of the poll published in Israel Hayom (not in Europe the day before yesterday, nor in Haaretz tomorrow) regarding public support for the government’s moves (it’s worth seeing the full results here):
This is of course just one poll among many. These results have been entirely consistent over months, and as noted it was neither conducted nor published on a typically left-wing platform. Against this backdrop it is clear that the talk about implementing the will of the majority is cheap demagoguery. True, a government has the right to implement policy even if it lacks majority support at a given moment, but when its policy is outrageous both in itself and in the public’s eyes, it cannot shelter behind majority support. Let them not tell me they are implementing the voter’s will, because they most certainly are not.[2]
It is important to understand that even if those who claim that these outcomes are mainly the product of the protest, and not only of government policy and legislation, are right (I also think there is truth to that), it does not really matter. In practice, the outcomes are outcomes that we will all suffer from, and the government bears responsibility to conduct itself with consideration for all the pieces on the board. It cannot shift responsibility onto someone else.[3] Beyond that, I also do not understand how anyone thinks that the paltry gain in passing the curtailment of the reasonableness doctrine (which has almost no legal effect) is worth the king-sized damage.
Others claim that all these warnings are leftist “fake.” (No problem—Tali Gotliv has already explained to us that Golani soldiers can be pilots too.) Sometimes they even bring other experts who claim otherwise. Perhaps they are right, though I very much doubt it (to understate the point). But one must understand: a private citizen can form an opinion about the seriousness of these warnings as he wishes. His opinion has no importance and he bears no responsibility for the results. But a government that makes policy and is responsible for the outcomes must be sure beyond a reasonable doubt that all these warnings are indeed fake. Almost the entire senior civil service (much of it appointed by them) warns against the government’s policy, and to ignore all that they would have to be certain that it is political fakery. Is there sufficient basis for such an assessment? Is the government’s assessment that there is nothing to these warnings itself not political? I greatly doubt it.
Back to Providence
Since in my view, although this coalition is the sum of all deficits and there is no blemish you will not find in it (“You are entirely fair, my love, and there is no blemish that you do not have”), not everyone in our government is a complete fool. I assume that at least some of them (especially Bibi) know that there is substance to these warnings—or at least are not certain there isn’t. So why do they nonetheless insist on ramming through a vacuous curtailment of the reasonableness doctrine and paying all these prices? Is the need not to yield to the “military putsch,” as they demagogically and baselessly dub it, worth these outcomes? Is it really worth plunging us all into the real danger of ruin? We have already become accustomed to their stupidity. To their conservatism and primitivism—of course. To their lies and corruption—obviously. To their trampling self-interest and indifference—this is the defining feature of this coalition. But to the irresponsibility and to the results for which they themselves will be responsible—how is it that they are not afraid of that? Are they counting on the stupid public to keep voting for them even if the state is in utter ruin? Will most of us truly go on casting ballots for “Bibi,” “Deri,” “Ben-Gvir,” “Goldknopf,” “Smotrich,” or “Avi Maoz,” even from the depths of the sea? To tell the truth, in light of what has been so far, I cannot rule it out.
Here we have a wondrous combination of cynicism and a stupid electorate out of the Likud’s school, a captive public of the Haredi parties whose vote for them is in no way contingent on their actions and achievements, and as for the religious-Zionist parties, it seems they and their devotees are following the path of Rabbi Herzog, of blessed memory. They are relying on providence.
It goes without saying, we are reminded, that we have a firm tradition that the Third Temple is not destroyed, and therefore we must not be daunted by economic, diplomatic, social, or security problems. Since we are on a sure path to complete redemption, and since everything this coalition does is “for the sake of Heaven” (that is, for the sake of the desecration of His great name), they are certain that the Holy One will take care of the problems and all will be well. The experts, to be sure, have their place, and their assessments are apparently substantive—or at least cannot be ruled out with certainty—but that is only in the secular fleshly eyes of the ignorant and rational masses. In the spiritual crystal eyes of our saintly rabbis, the “cliffs of the land” (that is, all those responsible for the greatest desecration of God’s name since the creation of the world), it is clear there is nothing to any of this, for such is Israel’s safe and irreversible redemption. Nothing can stop a mystical, meta-historical, supra-natural process like our complete redemption. Certainly not small, earthly economic or security considerations that could halt the “repair” (i.e., wrecking) of the world under the Kingdom of Shaddai.
I have no other explanation for this appalling irresponsibility. It appears to be the result of blind faith that the State of Israel cannot be harmed regardless of what we do—and certainly if it is done “for the sake of Heaven” (that is, the looting of the public treasury in order to sustain and entrench Haredi parasitism that is ruining and will ruin us all). Add to this religious-Zionist ideology the Haredi self-interest and indifference, and the fact that Bibi and the few of his Likud colleagues who remain sane have been taken captive by this motley collection of delusional idiots, and you have the scandalous conduct of this union of abominations.
Two Wrong Assumptions
Behind this deranged policy lie two distinct assumptions: (a) God is responsible for what happens. (b) His policy is clear to us, and He is leading us safely to redemption. From these two assumptions one can derive the conclusion that, should problems arise, He will sort things out for us. Both assumptions are needed to live within this delusion, for even if God is involved in everything that happens, how do you know that He will not destroy the state? After all, He (?) has already done so at least twice in the past. Note that the “tradition” I mentioned is responsible for the second assumption (hence the Brisker Rav, who shares the assumption that God is responsible for everything that happens, still is not sure that the state will not be destroyed, or that we will not be defeated in war).
It is worth remembering that whenever a disaster happened to us—or to any other people—I am sure that a few years earlier no one believed it would happen. Before the destruction of the Temple, I am sure everyone lived in tranquility and did not believe that such a catastrophe could befall them in their days. So too before the Holocaust; and so too in our own times. This is a common mistake: people assume that the familiar situation is necessary and could not be otherwise. In my estimation, unlike previous warnings, today there is indeed a non-zero chance of ruin—or at least a real catastrophe—in our state. It is no longer far-fetched.
I recall an event in Elkana, where I lived with my parents and siblings until I married. My late father, the elder of the community, who in his youth experienced the Holocaust in Budapest, Hungary, was invited to a panel on whether another Holocaust is possible. The other speakers confidently explained that the Third Temple is not destroyed and another Holocaust cannot happen. But he, as one who experienced the Holocaust, said almost matter-of-factly: I see no reason why a Holocaust could not happen again. We would do well to take into account that the situation we are in is neither guaranteed nor necessary. It seems that many components of our coalition of horrors are not truly considering that possibility.
What Is Messianism?
Many accuse this government (and the Kohelet Forum) of “messianism.” Usually what is meant is a tendency to impose a halakhic state here and thereby bring the Messiah. This is, of course, a disconnected discourse. None of the coalition’s components includes such a goal among its near-term objectives. They certainly want to impose more “Judaism” and exclude other ideas, but this is not truly heading toward a halakhic state, at least in the near term (in the coming terms).
In a paper my daughter, Bruria, wrote with my help, she analyzed the messianic features of religious Zionism. To do so, one must define the concept of messianism and distinguish its negative and positive components, and that is what I intend to devote the next column to. Here I will only say that the principal component of messianic conduct is reliance on meta-historical considerations and the (even partial) disregard of realistic, historical considerations. That is what we see here. This is especially true of the religious-Zionist components of the coalition (Smotrich, Ben-Gvir, and parts of Likud), but as I explained, they are dragging along all the rest, each for his own reasons (Haredi self-interest and indifference, or Bibi’s coalition constraints).
Therefore I actually agree that there is a very strong messianic component in this coalition’s policy. Their messianism is not expressed in striving for a halakhic state, but in ignoring realpolitik and acting according to meta-historical considerations. What I described above reflects this outlook and conduct. Sadly, this is not only a practical consequence of the belief in active providence but a policy liable to lead us all to disaster.
Smotrich’s “Redemptive Conduct”
Last night, as I was writing this column, I came across this article in which Rabbi Manovitz, head of the Golan Yeshiva, praises Smotrich for his “redemptive conduct.” Unlike Bibi, who conducts himself with historical awareness (this is entirely true in my view, which is why I find it difficult to reconcile it with his current policy, which is manifestly anti-historical), Smotrich and his party conduct themselves in a “redemptive” manner. Do not be mistaken: in Rabbi Manovitz’s eyes, and apparently in the eyes of many like him, this is praise, not criticism. Not only do they conduct themselves thus; they do not even contemplate the monstrous error in such conduct. It is considered praiseworthy.
Here are two paragraphs with the essence of the flaw:
He gave an entire lesson on Messiah son of Joseph and Messiah son of David. The study itself doesn’t matter, nor does it matter that he is well-versed in these things because he is a man of Torah—none of that matters. What matters is that he says to himself and to us: Look, what interests me is my role in this process. I do not live with historical consciousness; I live with redemptive consciousness and ask myself: What does the Master of the Universe want from me in this process?
There is no one here in our beit midrash—neither student nor rabbi—who thinks we are on the eve of destruction. There is no such thing. We are students of the Rav and of Rabbi Tzvi Yehuda; we think there is a redemptive process here. The difference between us and those who rejoice in the State of Israel but do not understand that there is a redemptive process is the difference between heaven and earth. We think there is a process that God is leading, and we are joining it.
I am sure Smotrich’s lesson on Messiah son of Joseph and son of David was instructive and profound—after all, he “understands” the topic (well, no one really understands it, which does not stop everyone from giving comprehensive lessons on it)—but I would recommend he stick to such lessons instead of leading us all to disaster. There is no student in the beit midrash who thinks disaster and ruin are possible—but that is precisely the problem. This redemptive fixation, with which they brainwash the youth, and whose products ultimately become our political and rabbinic leaders. Rabbi Manovitz also educates his students to conduct themselves “redemptively,” and blessed be God, it bears fruit. Thus has the messianism we now witness come into being. A pack of rowdy punks are implementing their rabbis’ doctrine under their active guidance and direction and are leading all of us to the abyss. If this is not messianism, I do not know what is.
By the way, Rabbi Manovitz there does not forget to pay the obligatory lip service to the “duty of hishtadlut”:
Rabbi Manovitz emphasized that this does not mean Smotrich has an insurance certificate. “Do not ask whether there is an insurance certificate here, whether you are a person like the finance minister, and I do not know pragmatists like him. Even his fiercest opponents speak of his learning curve at the Transportation Ministry, of how quickly he learned what that ministry is, and how quickly he learned the economic system. No one thinks he receives divine messages and lives by them.”
He notes that this “redemptiveness” does not prevent our revered leaders from weighing realistic considerations, and yet it is still the redemptiveness that guides them. But in practice, it seems they definitely ignore those considerations. And that is no wonder, for the thesis of “hishtadlut” is indeed untenable. If one adopts the belief in divine involvement with the two assumptions noted above, it follows that one should not engage in realistic hishtadlut. If no one thinks destruction is possible and if redemption is guaranteed, as Rabbi Manovitz says, then why fear it and/or act to prevent it?! If there is no insurance certificate, whence the certainty?! Has he anything against logic?! If his analytical Talmudic lessons look like this as well—saying one thing and its opposite sentence after sentence? Religious sloganeering and mental duality will have to answer. But my problem is not people’s logic; I have largely lost hope there. Our problem—all of ours—is the practical outcomes of this harebrained “logic.”
[1] Not that I understand why that promise—even if one takes it seriously—guarantees that the Brisker Rav would not be killed by a bullet, or even that Jerusalem would not fall. The Old City of Jerusalem, as we recall, did fall—until redemption “recovered” nineteen years later, in the Six-Day War.
[2] I have already explained (see for example column 553) that even if this were indeed the voter’s will, that would not delegitimize protest and opposition to changing the rules of the game.
[3] Moreover, this current coalition, when in opposition, tried to torpedo on its own—sometimes successfully—government measures, including those that were to its liking and, by its own lights, good for the country (such as visa-free travel to the U.S., applying Israeli law to settlers in the territories, taxes on disposables and sugary drinks, and much more). And we have not yet spoken of refusing to accept election results, which is not our direct concern here.
Speaking of redemptive consciousness, I highly recommend reading the list of Rabbi (Prof.) Yoel Elitzur, a very dear man. The consciousness from which the list was written is a consciousness of God's providence in our return to the Land, and more. Here it is:
https://www.inn.co.il/news/608890
Indeed, the guy is living in a real movie. Just look at this quote that is cited in support of the current coalition:
The people of Israel must inherit the land that was destined for them, and be a virtue among all nations, the elite and the moral model of the entire world.
I haven't seen the video, but someone like you who talks about people living in a movie is suffering from an extreme lack of self-awareness. Yes. The left is honest and moral. There is no selective enforcement at all. There are no lies and no mind engineering. People are responsible and gentle and not violent at all. Truly an example to the entire world.
The Left is morally upright – The problem lies in the flattening of the field of opinion that you are making. Everything the Rabbi claimed here is in no way equivalent to the claim that the Left is morally upright.
Consciousness engineering – The Rabbi commented that in his opinion there is much in the protest actions that caused the majority in the polls against the reform to form (if you mean consciousness engineering in the deep sense, Channel 14 style, we are not in a position to discuss anything at all)
Selective enforcement – How does this relate to anything that happens in this post? (Maybe give yourself an explanation for why it is appropriate to hate leftists)
Of course it has to do with the morality (which is non-existent) of the left.
From the beginning, the whole excuse for protesting is that the corrupt government will do whatever it wants. And that assumes that the protesting side is morally superior to the government and its voters. It's just that in the past, these guys were the ones who invented the Red Book. Maybe they're afraid that we'll do a Blue Book in revenge. Their fears indicate what they would do if they were in full power. Like the Arabs who fled in 1948 because they thought we'd do to them what they thought we'd do to us. Although the days of the Red Book are over, the mentality hasn't gone away and has only grown stronger over the years. They don't see the right at all. It exists for them.
Channel 14 is an amateur in mind engineering in what you call the "deep sense" compared to the other channels. It says what it thinks directly. The rest (like you) try to instill the messages in them as side-notes that should be self-evident to everyone who is "informed" and "sane" and there is nothing to discuss at all.
I am shocked by the amount of anger and venom you have
“There is a wonderful combination of cynicism and a stupid electorate here, from the Likud school” (and this is not the only statement in this vein)
This is a statement that is appropriate for a nihilistic Tel Aviv cynic, I don't remember you saying that before, are you considering running for politics?
I don't know why the reform has distorted your opinion of you, but it is unfortunate to read
The first person whose mind was disturbed by the reform is the usual Likud MK.
Contrary to what Miki writes, the electorate is not stupid, at least from those I know - quite a few of the people who voted for Likud in the last elections (and contrary to what the left is trying to portray - voted with the clear knowledge that they were going to try to reform the judicial system), with all this - are severely disappointed with the party's conduct.
Let's just start with their media brutality. Moving on to the absolute 0 in the ability to control the coalition. Failure to put a stop to the Haredi pig-headedness (which is rampant even without internal leadership to moderate it a bit, for those who haven't noticed - in fact, today it is the Haredi media (which leans to the extreme right) that controls the Knesset, there are no significant "marans" at all) etc. etc.
If they were just going through the motions, I'm not even talking about agreeing on certain things with the opposition (at least regarding the rules of the game regarding the separation of powers, that's required, regarding the other things (ultra-Orthodox recruitment and budgets, settlements, media, etc.) - the opposition can talk to the map (and that's how it always was and will be), after all, these are the things for which we gathered on election day, and after that the parties made their deals, with all the regret that goes with it - which is not the case with the rules of the game itself (which, let's say, leaves nothing of the turmoil they wanted to do with the reform - nothing. De facto the protest has won. All that remains is to pick up the pieces in the form of a unity government, which will unfortunately be extremely frivolous and not practical at all, but that's what was destined for us by the supreme providence), they would be buying the future of the government - not for another 4 years of Right on full full full, except for another 8 or more (we were in the next elections too). But the pig killed the cat.
Assuming that I understand that you are a “sane” right-winger: Are you saying that there are Likud voters who really think that their vote is worth less (and less than that of the Arabs)? Does that seem reasonable to you? They are just trying to please you. From my experience, people like you (more left-wing people) are tough and bitter people, so the Likud voters you know will tell you what they want to hear, but that is not what they really think in their hearts. After all, they voted for Likud after the entire war of the prosecutor's office and the media against Bibi, and they don't really believe that he is guilty, and they probably already know how corrupt the prosecutor's office and state institutions are. Do you think that a Likud voter (or any normal person) would care about the haredi pig and that their representatives in the Knesset (whom they know very well) say what they really think in the media and don't maintain a fake state image, more than that they will continue to remain second-class citizens? That they will make moves that will equalize their vote only with the consent of the other side...? That the other side will agree that their vote is equal? They do not accept true equality. They take it by force against the other side's will.
There are also (left-wing people) in my environment who are trying to engineer my consciousness like you. I give them a condescending and silent look. Very quickly, they are the ones who are already trying to please me.... The protest will subside, only the smart ones will be scared. But this is the war of independence of the right (and actually of the Jewish people).
Is this your first time here on the site?
In my opinion, this is his greatness. Unlike many cowards who do not dare to express a firm and honest opinion, Rabbi Michi says things in a blunt, direct and, in my opinion, correct way. What does a cynic, a Nihilist and a Tel Avivian have to do with it? You have to be blind not to see the failings of this government. The Holocaust happened yesterday in historical terms and it seems we have learned nothing.
3 questions:
1. Regarding Haredi pragmatism – Where does it disappear when their extremist leaders (most of them, if not all) put their entire public in a torture chamber of poverty, ignorance, and control? When a person lives off of nothing, it is more of a ‘redemptive perception’ than a ‘acceptable’ when they are shot– they run’…
2. Regarding what you wrote in the last line in the comments to the article: And we haven't even talked about not accepting the election results, which is not our direct concern here” – Forgive me, but then (in the previous Knesset) and today, the results were on the rocks with a slight bias in favor of the right. And what tipped the scales in favor of the “government of change” It was Bennett's decision, who found himself as the tongue of the scales (what the Haredim used to be) and he decided to go all in because he had no "council" that would prevent him from taking an executive role, and luck played in his favor. He says, "In the previous Knesset, the right's discontent was against the political game itself and not the election results, and today the discontent of the left and the center is against the form of the game (which is not dirty, but sloppy, pig-like, revolutionary and not evolutionary, and is brute-forced with a tentative tendency to poke a finger in both eyes of the opposing camp, and it seems that it has no control, but unfortunately it is definitely within the rules, in my opinion, and contrary to your opinion in this article and in previous articles).
3. In my opinion, all politicians are tainted with messianic concepts, each with his own stream, otherwise they wouldn't have carried their idea until they reached the Knesset... Come on, wasn't Ben-Gurion messianic and with a personality cult? The socialists (and the ultra-Orthodox activists) and the progressives who think that money grows on trees... don't they have a destructive messianic consciousness? The people who conduct political talks and negotiations of all kinds, aren't they messianic priests who walk up to their stirrups in the blood of sacrifices?? From everything I'm trying to scratch out from somewhere, some party was purely pragmatic, and not pragmatic-for-the-purposes-of-scaling-up-and-taking-over (did someone say Arab parties?), maybe maybe the general Zionists somewhere in the mists of the establishment of the state. So what are you excited about with Smotrich? Because he's in power? Because his opponents are supposedly harmful? Come out and see who his opponents are - those who are willing to do anything, but anything for international recognition, including peace sacrifices, etc. So this is a scumbag and a rip-off. Something megalomaniacal and evil is going on all over the right, but before that it also went on over the left. No one is free from megalomania, and rest assured that the government of "change", of blessed memory, if it had lasted longer, would have begun and perhaps continued and ended flirting with ideas of "peace" in the style of Oslo and Camp David. So maybe everything I wrote sounds like whatabautism, but the truth can be said that politicians by their very nature are mostly messianic, one on one side and one on the other. So the word "dictatorship" Terribly, terribly frightening (considering that the dictator is in his twilight years, for good health) for all of us, but apparently our memory is very short, because most of these actions, in their extremeness, existed here in the past in Israel (and it is true that there is really no reason to bring them back, but the minimum that is required of the older guys who protest - to look in the mirror), and on the other hand, messianic leftist policies are also terribly, terribly frightening, and get in our blood.
1. Pragmatism is a function of the goals. This policy is intended to preserve the distinct Haredi community and is therefore completely pragmatic. The Haredi will give up every value except for what threatens Haredi (its existence, not its values).
2. I will not go into these novel comparisons again. Right now the government does not represent the public and therefore its policy is not the will of the voter.
3. I explained the messianic nature of this coalition. You judge everything else by statements and not by actions.
2. These are not fanciful comparisons. This is reality. Both governments, this one and the previous one, were based on the same group deals (Bibi-Haredim-IDF on the one hand, and the wounded-Bibi on the other), and Bennett's "removal of the deterrent" is what was achieved. To the core of your words, the government is indeed far from representing its voters (even the Haredim), each one is pulling in his own direction, one with his long-standing vendetta against the system, the other to get himself out of a trial (although that is not entirely likely), the third to pour gasoline on the fire as much as possible, and the rest of the scoundrels surrounding the supreme rose. To gain as much airtime in the media as possible, but this does not concern the “election results”, which, as mentioned, and as the media today bothers to mention, are almost equivalent to each other.
3. Not true. To judge the messianism of the officials and ministers in the Rabin or Barak governments is to judge on statements and not on actions? To judge the semi-dictatorship of Mapai is to judge on statements and not on actions? To judge the destructive ideas of the progressive left (and its twin in the form of Haredi Puritanism) is to judge on statements and not on actions?
There is no comparison between Progress and any religion. Not even the most extreme ultra-Orthodox (Neturi Karta). It is the most messianic religion there is. And the most closed and fanatical. It is a religion that has no God (non-existence is its god (which is also the god of the religion of atheism). He is identified with its official god, which is the god of empty equality. In other words, both are manifestations of the same entity)
2. The government represents the will of the current public almost by definition. Everyone who votes for the Knesset also indicates that their vote is equal to that of others. So of course the public voted for the reform in the elections and the government is committed to this public. It is not committed to polls and is not even allowed to base itself on polls. Besides, if there are indeed Likud voters who are against the reform. That means that the choice not to be slaves of the left is not worth the price of reform (which is imposed on them by the masters from the left). In other words, they choose slavery for peace. Is there anyone who thinks that the Mizrahi Likud voters, who constitute the majority of Likud voters, do not care about their dignity? Especially when it comes to basic and essential dignity? I don't even see Ashkenazim who don't care
The left is much more messianic and its messianism is much scarier than that of the right. It goes far beyond money on trees. Think of communism and multiply by ten. And communism was worse than Nazism itself. And if we're talking about actions and not statements, I'm referring to the riots in Seattle by the progressives there. And there's no dividing line between the progressives who are there (that's there) and those who are there (language) because since progressives are anti-national and pro-global, in relation to progressives, "everyone is the same" (they're all the same)
How was the quote about the burning of Huwara not mentioned? A perfect combination of messianism and stupidity that has not been seen here since the establishment of the state, in my opinion. A finance minister who is not willing to be brought into a meeting in any Western country..
Regarding Bibi and the historical consciousness: This may have been true in 2015 (and here too I doubt it). Today the dominant consciousness is that of the wife and the child (it will be written in historical literature how much suffering the state went through because of the guy and the girl). The man is destroying the State of Israel with his eyes open. And because he is very smart, and also a true liberal (a capitalist who strongly believes in decentralizing power, even with regard to the Supreme Court), and messianism is very foreign to him, I have no doubt that he certainly knows how much he is burning here the economic future with the parasitic Haredim and the oppression of the people who are completely the fruit of his magnificent creation. Therefore, the conclusion is that he is evil.
We've already seen how many people have accused him of corruption, what can you do about it, and it all turns out to be a fabricated case. The only politician who really understands economics.
Even Yaron Zelicha, who is not enslaved to the brainwashing of the left, claims that the reform is not harmful to the filth
On the contrary. Yaron Zelicha claims that it will be beneficial. And that's just common sense. You don't have to be an economist for that.
I'm also in favor of burning Huwara. What's messianic about that? Just common sense and honest justice. You need to ask the question about yourself.
Besides, the state (the collection of institutions, officials, and structures) exists for the people of Israel and not vice versa. If the people of Israel win elections at the expense of destroying the state, then kudos to Bibi for having the courage to do it. That would be a first-rate leadership move. That's fine. From the left's perspective, Begin was also a murderer. Destroying the state (for the sake of building the people of Israel) is less bad than murder, right?
I thought the Minister of Finance's goal was to benefit the Jewish people and not to flatter the hypocritical Western countries. It's time to stop being hypocrites. Otherwise, there's no honor in the existence of the state
The state exists for all of its citizens, including those who are not at all part of the "people of Israel."
I will not defend with my blood such a state and no Jew should. Or any state at all. I am not fighting for institutions, I am only willing to defend the people of Israel (who are not ashamed of this concept and whose greatest sin is racism). Besides, if that is the case, then the state is like Russia. Do you think the Jews should have enlisted in the Tsar's wars?
And no. The state exists for the Jewish people. This is their only place in the world. A foreigner who does not think like that, as far as I am concerned, can be denied citizenship (I am not interested in giving citizenship to Arabs nor to non-Jewish immigrants from Russia (however useful they may be)). He will not pay taxes and will not vote for the Knesset.
The residents of Huwara are not citizens of the state in any way. I would be happy if they imposed sovereignty in Judea and Samaria, but that hasn't happened yet.
N ( ? ) – Stay tuned – Smotrich's record was broken by Dan Halutz .
( Search the Internet – Halutz, Titus ) .
And regarding messianism – There were people who said that it was possible to make an alliance with Arafat.
And even when they saw Arafat's words about the “Hudaybah Agreement” they didn't open their eyes –
And our rabbi has already explained how people live in mental seconds.
So who is the messianic and who is the corrupter? The right or the left?
Rabbi Mikhi is in a panic. And congratulations on being accepted into the leftist mafia
Of course it is the will of the majority. And certainly they do not conduct policy according to polls. In simple terms, those who oppose the reform simply say that the vote of the coalition voters is worth less. Plain and simple. The reform is simply the implementation of the elections. It is not a promise of elections. It is part of the election process. In order for it to have meaning. So Rabbi Mikhi tells us that there are some coalition voters who think that their vote is worth less. Not only that of the other side but also that of the Arabs. Even in the case that today the minority really supports the reform (and this is not a minority among the Jewish public) even then the reform should be passed because the majority cannot decide that the vote of an individual from the minority is worth less than the vote of his camp (in relation to future elections). I am pretty sure that if I explain what I just said to everyone who voted in the elections for the coalition, you will get a majority. And maybe so. Perhaps some of the coalition voters realized that their vote in the current situation is worth less and they decided to move to a camp where their vote (?) is worth more. In other words, they decided to replace their original belief with a ”faith” that will give them more profit and respect. In other words, they have no confidence in themselves, since that is how the gentlemen from the left decided: “Trust us because you yourself are not allowed to trust. But if you can try to engineer the minds of readers, then why not. This is what happens to mind engineers. He was like that too (the influence of the environment. The most powerful tool for shaping people's thoughts).
True. What Rabbi Mikhi is actually saying is that some Likud voters actually don't believe in themselves and therefore elect and trust people they think shouldn't be trusted and therefore object to their elections not being supervised by a group of people from the upper class who are not elected by them and who don't share the same values as them and who think that their vote is worth less and even less than that of the Arabs (!) and who also despise and hate them. Why not
Regardless, there's a good chance that the polls are rigged. It doesn't matter who orders the poll (by the way, it's well known among veteran readers of Israel Hayom that it's no longer right-wing since the Bennett government, since Bismuth left and the Rev. Miriam Adelson decided to change direction, but Rabbi Mikhi knows nothing) but who conducts it. A lot depends on how the questions are phrased. And let's not forget that people who work in the media field are leftists by the very nature of their profession (like all external and image professions: marketing, sales, advertising, lawyers, media people, etc.) and at this time of war, and he will be killed and will not pass (just as the country threw out Gadi Taub because of the reform), then any lie is justified. And Rabbi Michi will join in with all his might.
And of course the last and biggest lie. The transparent warnings that the reform is harming and will harm the country. So no. What is harming are the protests, the riots and the instability. This is a classic case of blaming the victim: “You have a beautiful face. Wouldn't it be a shame if you destroyed it?” These are actually the warnings.
There is no point in having a country where we will be slaves and will still shed blood for its existence. The idea of establishing the State of Israel, which has been made and continues to be made with blood, sweat and money, is that of a free Jewish people in their own land, not of a Jewish people enslaved in their own land. The Haredim are smart and picked up on this from the start.
Really mentally ill
What will happen to R’ Michi? Until you return to writing about important issues, politics will jump out at you? Not a joke…
Regarding intercession: 1) It is certainly psychologically beneficial, I do what I can to the end, and if it doesn't work, I come to terms with reality, after all, those who live like this are neurotically immune.
2) In my understanding, when they say that God intervenes in historical processes, they mean an aggregate sum. You see what has happened here economically and security-wise in the last 75 years, and even before that with all the immigration, etc., and you feel that the result is huge from the sum of its parts. Even secularists treat the state as a miracle (except for Leibowitz, who according to him the state should have collapsed 20 years ago. To teach you..).
Man-made, with a heavenly aroma. The aroma is the involvement.
1. The question is not whether it is psychologically beneficial, but whether it is true. Someone who adopts a delusional worldview because it is psychologically beneficial to them - psychologists have names for it. But let's just gently say that it is childish.
2. I did not deal with that debate here (whether God is involved in the world or not). I only pointed out problematic implications of this view.
Since most of the holy audience at the site of justice are among the disciples of ”religious Zionism” who have sucked messianism with their mother's milk, then their ability to accept that messianism can lead to destruction is similar to the ability of a German in the 1930s to understand that the 1000-year Reich will collapse in 988 years according to the calendar.
They are type AAA citizens, so if the majority of them voted that the sun will rise in the west and set in the east, that is their right, and any other manifestation of the sun will be further proof that they are oppressed type B.
1. Do you think there is no room for a consideration similar to that of “He who wants peace should prepare for war”? That is to say, if the right constantly compromises on the path of compromise and not destroying the country, it will not achieve anything. Each time it will succumb to bullying and it will be impossible to move forward.
2. This is a side issue in the column that you may have addressed in the past, but I will write it down anyway. Regarding your claim to Rabbi Manowitz's illogical logic’. Apparently, these are exactly the words of Mordechai to Esther “If you are deaf, be silent at this time, and a spirit and salvation will arise for the Jews from another place, but you and your father's house will perishÝ (I have heard an interpretation that the first part of the sentence is a rhetorical question, but it sounds less like that, and the letter “and” before the word “you” is less relevant. In any case, the interpretation of the verse interests me less, but rather the relation to the classical interpretation.) That is, there will truly be a general salvation for the people of Israel and the end will be good, it does not mean that now it will be good if you do not act. What is the problem with this logic?
1. There is room for such a consideration, and I mentioned it. But there is common sense and proportion. And this is not about the right wing surrendering. There is a clear majority in the public against these scandalous moves, and a large part of the right wing is there too. And not just the right wing that voted for Saar and Bennett and Lieberman and Yoaz Hendel, but also the right wing that voted for Likud. Look at the data I provided. The right wing also did not always surrender to the left wing. There are certain steps in which it is appropriate to “surrender” (essentially, to understand that you were wrong). The desire to win at all costs led to the passage of a law devoid of any practical significance (reducing the reason for reasonableness) at a terrible cost, and by the way, also at the cost of the other sections of the reform that are more significant and will now be more difficult to pass.
2. I have written more than once that I am not concerned with the Bible. I am just wondering in your opinion why it was so important to Mordechai that Esther act if in any case nothing depends on it?
For our purposes, the problem here is the (rare) cases in which realpolitik considerations are ignored. Especially when it is done for purposes that are in no way related to the name of God, but rather the opposite (to desecrate the name of God). Ask yourself: If the economy collapses and the army disintegrates and our foreign relations collapse and society is torn apart and many people leave the country, but profit and salvation will come to us from somewhere else in fifty or a hundred years, is that worth the reduction in the reason for plausibility? Or maybe the profit and salvation will be in a state that will be established in five hundred years, after we have all drowned in the sea. Is that also worth the reduction in the reason for plausibility?
There is also the surrender of the right. Of course, it is impossible to count the voters for the opposition as right-wing (which right-winger is someone who supports the Supreme Court and a state for every citizen of its own and affirmative action for Arabs? Who is in favor of the Land of Israel but against the people of Israel. I would return to the 1948 lines in exchange for reform and for there to be a distinctly Jewish state where Jews prefer Jews over foreigners without being ashamed or apologizing for it) but let's even assume for the sake of discussion that there really are (although it doesn't make sense at all) Likud voters who oppose reform. As a Smotrich voter, won't I use my power as a necessary part of keeping Bibi and the Likud in power so that my vote is not worth less than the vote of the rest of the public? After all, this matter has no significance for the majority of the public. It cannot decide (as long as I contribute as much as I can to society) that my vote is worth less (for future matters and future elections). Should I give it up because it has a price? That's what the Haredim did. But you're the one who's coming at them with claims that they don't enlist and don't contribute taxes when they're working in this country. They, in their great wisdom, were able to exploit the situation to their advantage and decided to sell their votes for the highest price. Do you want all the coalition voters to also become Haredim?
1. It seems to me that it can be estimated that the vast majority of right-wing voters support reducing the reason for reasonableness (an unimportant law, I don't even understand why there should be opposition unless they fear that this is the beginning of the enactment of other laws). Why should one submit to bullying regarding such a law?
Incidentally, in my opinion, Bibi passed this law to throw a bone to the right and the story of legal reform is over. But time will tell.
2. The Bible wasn't the issue. I already gave an opening to explain the verse differently. I meant that the verse, in this understanding, explains the logic by which people act. As I said, it's not true to say that nothing depends on it. “You and your father's house will perish” meaning that there will indeed be people who will be harmed by Esther not doing something. But in the end, the people of Israel will overcome the problem.
It may not be worth reducing the reason for reasonableness. But the intention is that a person will have a certain peace of mind, that even if not now, then in five hundred years or so, profit and salvation will come to the Jews. I did not come to discuss the details of this case, only to say that this is the logic of security and calm.
Interim proposal
In many ways I agree with the legal reform
However, the ultra-Orthodox and religious parties have made every effort to show that the goals are not legal justice but jobs and chairs.
What's the problem with the religious parties? Don't they contribute to the state? Don't they work? Don't they serve in the IDF?
Why lie? Smotrich agreed to give up a sectoral benefit, a job, and a chair so that a right-wing government with Arabs would not be established. Ben Gvir would have done the same thing. They are the furthest from jobs there are. Even Merav Michaeli said of Smotrich that he is a man of values.
I have written more than once that I also agree with the necessity of reform, although not in the format they are trying to promote, and in no format is it really acute. It is certainly not the most important issue on the agenda and is not worth the crazy prices we are paying for this lack of reform.
exactly
Public service: The column does not address the question of whether the reform is good or who is to blame for the situation we have reached. These things are barely mentioned in side comments that are not essential to the matter. The column addresses the fact that given the current situation in which the continuation of the legislation causes harm (no matter whose fault it is), it is problematic to continue only with the mistaken idea that ”it will be okay”.
Guys, you need to drink a glass of water and read what is written before reacting angrily, it is a shame for your health.
Nice comment. One sane voice in mad Sodom. Just add the theological aspect that I added here.
I thought it was unnecessary because that is the main content of the column, but since the rabbi asks:
Public Service 2: The main point of the column is to refute the “it will be okay” approach. The rabbi claims that it comes mainly from the theological thought that the Third Temple will not be destroyed. This thought is actually made up of two assumptions: A. God intervenes in what is happening in the world and imposes His will. B. We know His will and His will is that the State of Israel will not be destroyed. The rabbi disagrees with both assumptions, but even for those who believe that God intervenes in the world (assumption A), assumption B is still unfounded, and evidence of this is from the rabbi’s approach to Brisk and the pragmatic conduct of the Haredi public in general. Therefore, the assumption that “it will be okay” And the State of Israel cannot be destroyed by mistake, and therefore it must not be relied upon to continue to enact the reform.
Maybe the Rabbi should find an editor who will summarize the main argument in the political columns, it will save a lot of heartache for the angry commenters and readers 🙂
Who told you it would be okay, not in the long term? Of course, there are short-term costs. Besides, a war for freedom has always been beneficial. Even the Bar Kokhba rebellion, which failed at a great cost in blood, meant that the Romans no longer issued extermination decrees against the Jews until the end of the empire (and there were no such decrees against the Jews of the Land until the establishment of the state).
By the way, the non-main part of the article is no less important to him. After all, he bothers to repeat his (horribly stupid) disdain for the real right over and over again and never misses an opportunity. I think this message is no less important for him to convey than the message that was supposed to be the main message of the column. Maybe the opposite. Maybe the main message of the article is to once again slander the right and engineer consciousness (out of a desperate and pathetic hope that someone might switch sides after the insults) and the thought part is just a cover and a wrapper for it and is the side thing here.
Is the freedom of the right-wing public not worth the damage that the protest causes?
It may not be right in the short term. But those who surrender to slavery will worsen their situation in the long term, even in the area for which they surrender to this slavery. That's what we learned from the Holocaust and from European Jews. On the contrary, the establishment of the state cost a lot of blood and money, but in the long term it turns out that this investment paid off (at least for the leftists) in itself + a nice return.
As one of the commenters wrote very nicely here, the main point of the war is whether a right-winger has a voice worth less than a left-winger, and if you say that the Haredim's is indeed worth less, then you have the Arabs against them, whose voice is worth even less than the Haredim's. In other words, this is a war for the freedom of the right versus slavery under the left.
Now, do you think this doesn't justify all the prices that this freedom costs? (The destruction of the economy, the stockpile, etc.). I learned that people fought to the death for freedom, and so it is fitting that whoever eats the stinking fish in the end will also be expelled from the city. In other words, in the long run, the economy will flourish, etc. This seems to me to be a very real political consideration.
There is no contradiction between effort and faith that God is watching over us.
Bezalel Smotrich can be certain in his soul that everything is from God, and on the other hand make effort (without going crazy).
The mental state of one who believes + the intensity of effort shows providence from the Creator.
If we bring this to the practical world of each and every one of us -
If I received a certain diagnosis from a doctor (this is effort), I do not go for a second, third, fourth opinion, etc. (there is no shortage of people who, due to effort, have already gone for a huge number of opinions).
Also: I was at a job interview, I answered as best I could and I understood (this is effort). I am not going to worry now and be stressed about when they will get back to me. I am not going to call the interviewer/recruiter every so often and ask him “Did you accept me” (And I'm certainly not going to flatter myself to be accepted)
This whole thing is a system of different balances between effort, confidence in it, and the mental position I'm in.
For me it's very simple and works out. All you need to do is not present it in black and white, and then everything works out.
Absolutely. If you don't think, everything will work out. Just don't take the logic too seriously.
I understand that it is difficult to deal with the argument I brought (which is quite simple), to ridicule my response, and to continue to adhere to ”black or white”, but that does not change the fact that my argument is correct –
Effort without going crazy = true faith in God.
But it seems to me that after a response or two I got the point and made the most of my visit to the site.
Good luck
Regarding the question of what Bibi thinks, it is quite clear to me that he understands the situation very well and that he has no intention of passing a significant reform. As you wrote yourself, there is not much meaning in reducing the grounds of reasonableness and he passed it only to create a feeling that something is being done, for the voters who are in favor (even if they are a minority, it is certainly a significant minority that votes for the parties of the coalition). Many within the Likud are already saying that they will not vote in favor of other laws without broad consensus. As soon as the reform is stopped, or something is passed by consensus and without protests against it, the world will understand that it was all a storm in a teacup.
Of course, regarding the government's actions that are not related to the legal reform, you are right that they are terrible, but the 'reform' is a smokescreen and no one is paying attention to it.
The rabbi constantly complains that people live on unfounded theories such as providence. I recommend that the rabbi, in his free time, watch the series "How to Become a Cult Leader" where they professionally review all kinds of cults with all kinds of delusional and unfounded theories, and then the rabbi will see that the situation with me is not so difficult.
Israel Today is no longer a right-wing newspaper (the article claims that it is even left-wing anymore):
https://actualic.co.il/%D7%94%D7%A4%D7%9A-%D7%9C%D7%A2%D7%99%D7%AA%D7%95%D7%9F-%D7%94%D7%A9%D7%9E%D7%90%D7%9C-%D7%94%D7%A6%D7%A2%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%97%D7%95%D7%A7-%D7%A9%D7%9C-%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%9B%D7%95%D7%93-%D7%A0%D7%92/
And also here:
https://www.news1.co.il/Archive/0026-D-152900-00.html
The truth is that your column is a bit funny. While most columns are excellently reasoned, asking about moral and philosophical principles,
This column is exactly the opposite, it indicates the goal, the things you don't like, and then cuts back on the evidence.
On the contrary, let's argue about the foundation of the majority decision in the Knesset elections, the nature of the polls and the impact on public decisions following them.
And about polls (and what is your evidence? "Polls on a non-leftist platform." That's about the level of information from which average rabbis derive fateful public decisions)
I also don't like many of the public statements, and the stupidity that exists in large parts of the Knesset, but this is an opportunistic claim and not a principled claim
She is actually pro-leftist: that is, she is right-wing “sane”. Here is an article that mentions this in passing:
https://mida.org.il/2023/04/21/%d7%94%d7%a8%d7%a4%d7%95%d7%a8%d7%9e%d7%94-%d7%94%d7%a7%d7%a4%d7%99%d7%a6%d7%94-%d7%90%d7%aa-%d7%94%d7%a9%d7%9e%d7%90%d7%9c-%d7%9b%d7%99%d7%aa%d7%94/
A. The claim that the importance of the reason for reasonableness does not justify the harm it brings as a result of the protest against it is equally true in the other direction. After all, you support all those measures that harm the economy and the army. However, if the reason for reasonableness is so insignificant, it should not justify such harm.
It turns out that you will respond that your support for that harm is because the reason for reasonableness is only the first slice of the Salami method, or because all of the government's actions are bad in your eyes. But the same argument serves the government's supporters just as well. They understand that the protests against them are intended to deny them the legitimacy to govern (as you can see in the video of the protest leaders on the 555 forum from three years ago, the reform is not the background to the protests but only the trigger), and therefore they also insist on laws that are not so significant in themselves, due to the strategic implications. This is equivalence.
B. As I understand it, you claim that in biblical times there was providence and intervention. Do you think Hezekiah, King of Judah, could do whatever he wanted, since given the prophecy of prosperity he received, there is no point in interceding? It turns out not, because the prophecy is not an insurance policy but is stated under certain conditions (if Hezekiah had jumped off the roof, it turns out that the prophecy that adds fifteen years to him would be nullified). Since this is the case, there is no reason why a person cannot believe that the establishment of the state is part of the process of redemption, without it harming his consideration of realistic considerations. As far as I am concerned, this is also the case with Smotrich, even if there is a rabbi who will embellish it with all kinds of embellishments. If you did not find a logical explanation, I offered you one such in the first section, even if you do not agree with him, there are those who do.
I explained this in the column. Partial supervision does not contradict effort.
How do you know that Smotrich believes in complete providence?
I have no information. I explained in the column why I suspect that at least regarding the "redemption", he has complete confidence. As is usually the case with all religious Zionism, and as his host, the Rosh Yeshiva of the Golan, also assumes with confidence.
“It is worth remembering that every time a disaster has happened to us, or to any other nation, I am sure that a few years ago no one believed that it would happen. Before the destruction of the house, I am sure that everyone lived peacefully, and did not believe that such a catastrophe could happen to them and in their lifetime. This was the case before the Holocaust, and it is the same today. This is a common mistake, as people assume that the situation they are familiar with is necessary and cannot be otherwise. In my opinion, contrary to previous warnings, these days there is definitely a non-zero chance of destruction or at least a real catastrophe in our country. It is no longer unfounded.”
This is exactly what was before the disengagement – how many people really believed that it would actually happen?
It seems to me that there is also a quasi-practical consideration that allows religious Zionists – and especially the Haredim – to ignore the scandalous conduct of the government. I think many of them have simply come to the conclusion (in one way or another) that in order to prevent the next Oslo or disengagement, it is permissible to swallow any frog and even let the Haredim do as they please. Of course, the messianism you described allows them to delude themselves that there will be no price for it.
Nice theory.
The theory is – people in government do stupid things with disastrous results.
The reason that smart people behave this way – is because they believe in the stupid providence you claim.
Wow!!!
Well, if the ’Messians’ were among the anarchists in the Kaplan demonstrations, or among the reserve refusers, or among those who spend their investments abroad – the theory would sound better. Why destroy the country? That's what needs to be done, we won't think about the damage.
But, what can we do if the ’Messians’ are on the side that seeks dialogue. On the fair side that wants to realize the will of the majority!
Well, leave it, facts won't change reality.
Speaking of the famous poll, I believe that it reflects the truth. But it represents a misrepresentation!! I will explain.
“Who supports the Basic Law on Torah Study”? Obviously not many. Especially in the current situation. What's the connection?
“Who understands the evasive people”? If the wording of the question was “Should evasive people be punished” then the true results would be reflected, which in my opinion is a high positive percentage. What does it have to do with ”understanding them”???
“Do you support reducing the reason for reasonableness” – It is clear that everyone in the opposition is against, another 10% of the coalition think that a broader consensus is needed. Okay. Most voters claim that in their minds.
“Is the reform weakening” – It is clear that it is weakening. But it is impossible to surrender to anarchism that is essentially against the government. Greater damage will be done without passing the reform.
“What to do if the rest of the reform” – A large majority thinks it is desirable. Softened by broad agreement.
A survey whose questions are aimed at the majority who will vote against. According to Bibi's method, “Peres will divide Jerusalem”.
This is a false representation that the government is failing. The protesters are on the side of light compared to the government's darkness.
And if the questions are biased, I quite suspect that the survey results are biased as well.
It is enough for us to remember the statement "whatever happens, will not happen" that led many believers (including me) to take absurd steps and invert logic to set an example. People bought houses, sowed fields, etc. as if nothing would happen. Not to mention the lack of mental preparation for adults, youth, and children whose entire world changed before their eyes. Who will judge their case? Who will judge their fate?
What are you trying to say?
What is not clear? Out of blind, messianic faith, thousands of people continued to behave as if there would be no disengagement. The rabbis and parents who preferred to encourage denial of reality are largely responsible for the suffering inflicted on their children.
A significant part of the suffering endured by the residents of Gush Katif was caused by their unwillingness to accept that they were going to be displaced from their homes, “for real”, for the reasons described by Rabbi Michael. Among other things, this caused them to not cooperate with the body established by the state to compensate them and give them money/a replacement home. It is clear that the administration was not perfect either – it was a public and bureaucratic body – but it was clear in real time that many people suffered far more than they should have, due to their unwillingness to talk to the administration.
Israel – Do you live in Israel?
The director acted very badly – and moreover – the government assured the court
that everything is in order, everyone has a solution – which turned out to be a farce.
I did not determine – the State Comptroller determined.
(The Supreme Court could have understood that six months or even a year is too short a time
but then it was reasonable – explains why there is no faith in ”supreme” )
It was only thanks to the Supreme Court that the evacuees received mountains of money. I recommend reading Nehemiah Strassler's articles on the subject (and I also know firsthand, the amounts they received are truly insane).
What a joke. People are not opposed to courts, but to judicial activism. There is no case of judicial activism here.
The question is how catastrophic are the considerations you define as ’realpolitik’, and are we indeed on the verge of destruction, or is there mainly an *air* of catastrophe here? It is no secret that many of the powerful institutions in our society are controlled by people who have very strong ideological opposition to any reduction in the authority of the Supreme Court. The popular public, which you so despise, manages to understand this, and even less popular people have written about it (for example: Shmuel Trigno, ”The New Dominant Ideology: Postmodernism”, 2012 – for those interested). Given that these powerful institutions currently have two parallel interests: 1. Not to destroy the country in which they exist with sufficient force 2. To stop the legal reform – The idea of the atmosphere-but-not-really-catastrophe theory is not so far-fetched. Now, how do we know if it's an atmosphere, or if we're really facing long-term consequences? Use common sense. Indeed, the financial market is responding. But responding to what? It's responding to this hysterical and exaggerated protest, which is based on nothing and nothing, especially when the initial proposals fell through. So when the noise dies down, things will balance out. I have no doubt that it wouldn't be difficult to find other periods in our history during which the financial market responded to social dramas. But who would want to show that? Nobody. Which brings us to the last point, which has been repeated several times in the comments here (thank God, there are sane people in Sodom!): We brainwash people. We pump them 24/7 that we're heading for disaster, we equip them with people in suits and a lot of authority who pump it up too – and whoops, here we are. And don't let them lie to you: this is not a conspiracy. We live in an era of ultra-liberal mass media, fully mobilized, and this is happening in other places in the world as well.
Besides the fact that there is good reason to think that we are in an atmosphere of catastrophe, and not a real catastrophe, there is another issue: there is a public of people here who want to shut up. It doesn't matter to you, of course, because they are a bunch of fools and blah blah blah cynicism cynicism contempt contempt...
A whole public of people whose set of values does not coincide with that of the High Court, certainly not the ways of balancing these different values. They have something to say about dealing with infiltrators, about the legitimacy of separating women and men in various institutions, about the death penalty/deportation for terrorists, and so on and so forth. And they are interested in influencing the way their country decides on these issues, and they don't want to be shut up. Democracy, etc.! This is a very strong consideration for why we should continue with the reform, even if not in the format that the proponents initially chose for it.
The surreal times we live in make me identify with a position I previously shared, that the legal system is not undergoing any reforms at all. The behavior of our politicians makes me think that they need to be restrained even more. Moreover, if we are to reform the legal system, it would be better to reform much worse distortions in our political system, such as the Chief Rabbinate, the separation of religion and state, a corrupt government culture, etc. Why should we reform the legal system first? Do we want to commit suicide?! If we are to survive, we must demand that the legal system not be balanced without addressing the much more serious distortions that have existed in our system for ages.
These days, when a completely corrupt gang is promoting reforms in the legal system, provide the best propaganda about the importance of a strong court in our Levantine provinces.
But the court, the prosecutor's office, and the police are the gang that has been corrupt since time immemorial. The rule of law gang. A judge who does not rule according to the letter of the law but inserts his own agenda into it is a criminal. There is nothing to talk about the prosecutor's office and the police at all. Elections are the balance for politicians. Your feeling that they do what they want is brainwashing by the left and Rabbi Michi. In the previous government, the left did whatever they wanted (political appointments, Norwegian laws, personal laws (the defendant's law), returning territories again on their own accord). The prosecutor's office in general has been assassinating every ministerial candidate (from the right, of course) since the 1990s who they don't like by opening an investigation that ends with the person being investigated being acquitted but his appointment being thwarted. Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious enforcement is selective. The lawyers are the enemies of the Jewish people. In such a situation, let's say the other side also has the feeling that it is allowed what is allowed to one side. The very fact that you ignore all this shows that this lie, which is greater than any corruption (since it is accompanied by a deep self-conviction that everything you do is true because there is no truth and justice (the perception of postmodernism. The religion of the left)) shows that you are also a liar. In fact, the legal system does not require amendments but D9. Complete destruction. But we are conservatives and do not like revolutions (I also think that the reform laws should have been passed quietly, slowly, without announcing anything. Like the High Court did. But no one believed how dishonest the left could be) We do not destroy an old world to the ground before building something in its place. Because in truth, all the activist judges should have been dismissed if not prosecuted for acting without authority.
What you are saying is that we need a strong king to veto parliament like they wanted during the French Revolution. What stupidity
A few comments on things you wrote:
1. Regarding the budget increase for the Abrahimi that you mentioned, I understood from the media that this was an addition that resulted from a technical mitigation of a calculation error and not from any new, initiated addition.
2. It is possible that passing the law to reduce the grounds of reasonableness will actually bring the compromise between the sections of the people closer by sending a message to the opposition that they cannot continue to insist only on what they want in negotiations, in other words, it is an exercise in negotiations.
3. The experts who warn about harm to the economy are starting from the assumption that the reform will harm democracy and therefore the economy will also be harmed, but this is actually the desired assumption. Even the right will agree that if democracy is harmed, then the economy will also be harmed. They simply disagree on the starting point of harm to democracy. And this is already a question in which an economic expert has no comparative advantage.
4. If the government backs down from passing the law to reduce the likelihood of conviction, protests may arise from the right, and the government needs to calm them down as well. Especially since the bone it threw at them is very small, as you wrote.
I would appreciate your comment.
Regarding 3: The literature in question on economics does not deal with something abstract like harming democracy, but with quantifiable things like the concentration of power, the ability and willingness of those in power to make irrelevant decisions, preserving the rights of minority groups, the importance of property rights in the eyes of the government, and so on. In the indicators of these qualities, any reasonable person can see that the current government and its members are on a trend of moving in less favorable directions, and I am being gentle with my words. Therefore, the experts' warnings about the government's misdeeds are in their place and should be heeded.
1. I didn't go into the details of this addition. But why does it matter if it was promised before? It's still very problematic money. An old injustice is not an injustice?
2. I hope you're right.
3. Not true. The problem is not only democracy but government policy, which the reform only makes easier. Beyond that, the assessments of whether or not there is democracy are no less important than the situation itself. As we know, in economics, expectations are part of the issue itself.
4. A wise man does not enter situations that a wise man knows how to get out of.
So regarding 4, if I understand you correctly, the move to reduce the probable cause is a smart move given the current situation?
No. I wrote along the way, if you'd like to say: I don't think it's wise, but even if it were wise, a truly wise person wouldn't get into such a situation.
If you remove the Arabs from the equation, the majority of the public does support reform. Much more than 64 seats.
For similar reasons as removing the Arabs from the equation, the ultra-Orthodox and some of the religious should also be removed. And yet, the majority of the public opposes the reform.
Similar considerations to what?
There is reasonable logic in the founding foundations of the Jewish state to give only Jews influence (king style ‘from among your brothers’) even if it is a democratic state with equal rights for members of all nationalities and especially if it is an ideological enemy of the Jewish state. Haredim and some of the religious - as far as I have checked - are Jews.
Have you checked the polls on the drafting of the Law of Return, the Oslo Accords, the evacuation of Gush Katif, the gas agreement with Lebanon, etc.?
And what about other countries? Does the pension reform in France mean anything to you? Where do you live? New democracy of referendums and we'll talk later
Another solution as a public service: a serious diet in news consumption (it doesn't matter if you're a 12 or 14 type) and brainwashing – and then comes Zion Goel. Suddenly it turns out that everything is a joke 🙂
In the 17th of Elul, 1933
Unlike the author of the post, Rabbi Herzog's belief that the return to Zion in our generation is a preparation for redemption – demanded from him a duty of extra effort. As a leader, he saw himself obligated to be with his people during their struggle. Therefore, he returned to the land to be with the public during the danger of the German invasion; and therefore he remained in besieged Jerusalem to strengthen the besieged public, and in both decisions – the believer was privileged to see salvation. The land did not fall into the hands of the Germans, and Jerusalem did not fall into the hands of the Arabs.
With blessings, Fishel
However, in situations that seemed clearly hopeless, such as Gush Etzion in its final days – Rabbi Herzog acted, according to what I remember reading – And he tried with the British and Israeli authorities to allow an orderly evacuation of the defenders of the bloc, in order to prevent them from falling into the hands of the enemy. An optimistic view of the move as a whole does not contradict the duty of caution in its details.
According to me (in the last paragraph) – see (for now) in the ’Chronicle of Gush Etzion’ (on the Kfar Etzion Field School website) 4 Iyar 5778: ‘After the fall of Kfar Etzion in battle, David Ben-Gurion ordered, in consultation with Chief Rabbi Herzog, to arrange the surrender of the defenders of the Gush’.
Best regards, Fish’l
Rabbi Herzog's initiative to evacuate the defenders of the Gush began days before, as described by Dov Knohl: ‘ “On that night” between Tuesday and Wednesday (Or 14 Iyar) a great many people wandered in Jerusalem. Rabbi Herzog went to the district headquarters and asked for permission to contact the ’Red Cross’ to evacuate the defenders of the Gush. He was told that permission had to be obtained from the national headquarters in Tel Aviv’ (Gush Etzion in its War, pp. 460-461).
Another proposal made by the district headquarters, which was also rejected, was to send forces from Jerusalem to assist the defenders of the Gush, while violating the ceasefire in Jerusalem. What was done was an unsuccessful attempt to provide air support by bombing the enemy forces and dropping ammunition to the defenders (ibid.). Only after the massacre in Kfar Etzion on 14 Iyar did Ben-Gurion (in consultation with Rabbi Herzog) order the defenders of the Gush to surrender to the Jordanian Legion.
This order marked a change in Ben-Gurion's policy, which initially opposed any evacuation of a Jewish settlement, and later ordered B&G to also evacuate the besieged Atarot, understanding that there was no point in waging a hopeless struggle. The one who disagreed with B&G was the commander of the Jerusalem District, David Shaltiel, who believed that the defenders of the Gush should be evacuated to Jerusalem.
In contrast to the commander of the district, the district commander, Ben-Zion Eldad, and the Gush commander, Moshe Silberschmidt, believed that the Gush had an important role in the defense of Jerusalem by delaying Arab transportation bringing forces to the enemy besieging Jerusalem and by diverting the enemy's forces. Mosh organized the forces for a regular attack on Arab transportation to Jerusalem, and hoped that with the declaration of the state, the bloc could serve as a ‘springboard’ for lifting the siege of the Negev. A strategy that proved impossible with the Battle of B”Nisan, in which tanks and artillery from the Legion attacked the bloc.
However, the believing Rabbi Herzog was more pragmatic than Ben-Gurion…
With greetings, Fish”l
The material I have provided and the analysis are based on the work of Livnat Vardi (under the supervision of Dr. Haim Shalem of Efrata College), which was heavily based on Motka Golani‘s article in the collection ‘Gush Etzion until 1988’.
For Rabbi Herzog's halachic instructions to Gush Etzion besiegers, see Karni Eldad's article, "Halachah in Siege," on the Makor Rishon website.
Best regards, Fishel
In response to ‘And before that’, in the last line
… In the article by Motka Golani, ‘Jerusalem District Headquarters and Gush Etzion in 1988’, in the collection ‘Gush Etzion –From its beginnings to 1988’ (published by Yad Yitzhak Ben-Zvi, can be viewed on the ‘Koter’ website).
However, even from the perspective of the process of revival in our generation as a stage on the road to redemption, there is room on the one hand for the aspiration that the state be more ‘Jewish’, but on the other hand, part of the preparation is in creating unity and national consolidation, which on the face of it invites the aspiration to create change precisely through broad consensus.
On the other hand, surrendering to rioters who are attempting to cause economic and political collapse through violence and threats is also not appropriate for state behavior. What is more, it is likely that the ’elites’ are not really interested in carrying out the threats, since an economic collapse will not benefit the wealthy, and it is possible that the threats are nothing more than a ‘rabbit dilemma’ tactic designed to ’bend the opponent’.
The article by Rabbi Yaakov Ariel, the Council for National Unity (B'Sheva, Parashat Shofitim) is interesting, in which he suggests that intellectuals from all sectors come together to draft a 'social charter' that will allay the fears of both sides, those who fear radicalization in the 'Jewish' sense and those who fear radicalization in the 'democratic' sense.
With greetings, Fishel
For the record, what Netanyahu did, seeing that the attempts at a negotiated discourse were not making progress, was to pass a limited law to 'remove the ground of reasonableness', in the expectation that it would reach the High Court. When in fact, when his attorney was asked by the High Court if he would comply with the ruling, he replied in the affirmative.
In doing so, Netanyahu threw the ball in the direction of the High Court, whose judges also understand the problematic nature of invalidating a Basic Law. In doing so, he “covered himself”; what do you care? If the High Court approves the law, it has approved it; and if it does not approve, Netanyahu will make it clear to his partners that he made the effort.
It is good to read the sharp and clear words against this coup d'état, and I cannot help but agree with the theological analysis that explains the mindset of the religious right voters and their representatives. It was interesting to read how the author perceives the connection between the settlements and messianic ideologies.
You previously wrote a nice column about why Ukraine should not compromise even a quarter of an inch with Russia - even though it led to war, chaos and destruction. Now copy and paste it here. If they had surrendered on the grounds of reasonableness, the situation in the legal system would never have changed. In fact, it would have been impossible to lead almost any move at a time when there was such a simple weapon to overturn any decision by the government. This is not a stupid public, this is a public that is tired of being silenced by aggressive force and understands that surrendering here will only worsen the situation.
Secondly, the Likud MKs are also actually in favor of reform by consensus (most of them), but in order to reach consensus, one must present an extreme position (this was actually the desire from the beginning, to present the most extreme reform, so that they would compromise later, which turned out to be a fatal mistake, of course). If you compromise from the start, the next compromise will already bite off three-quarters of your initial position (two I will hold in the tallit..) so that the government is essentially trying to promote the opinion of the majority of the public, which is to promote reform by consensus, and the way to do this is by presenting an extreme opposing position. In any case, given the current state of the situation, it seems that it will not pass one way or another.