Q&A: The Haredi Argument Regarding Education
The Haredi Argument Regarding Education
Question
A lot of the criticism of the Haredi public, both regarding military service and participation in the economy, carries a great deal of weight and logic.
But I wonder: in your opinion, is there really nothing to the Haredi apologetic argument about education?
The Haredim in Israel are the religious group that is most successful at preserving and making present faith, observance of Torah and commandments, and Torah study among future generations.
More than American Jewry, and much more than Religious Zionism.
I get the impression that you believe that observance of Torah and commandments and Torah study are critical, binding, and necessary parts of Jewish life.
Does the fact that there is a group here that succeeds in passing that message on to its children carry no weight in your eyes?
That is, non-enlistment and the economic burden are moral distortions on the one hand,
but on the other hand, one cannot ignore that there is a clear causal connection here to tremendous success in education.
Answer
This question has come up here again and again. I’ll answer briefly.
- The facts are not correct. There is a great deal of secularization among the Haredim, except that they do not admit it, and part of it happens in secret (the coerced hidden ones). But even those who remain are believers in the wrong religion—the Haredi religion, not the Jewish religion. So what value is there in the survival of such a thing?! And all this is done only because of the support they receive from their surroundings, without which they cannot live, and through a terrible desecration of God’s name. So what is this distorted fear of Heaven worth?! Is defending the Jewish people not part of the commandments? And what about “and live by them”? And sharing the burden with one’s fellow? And proper conduct? And teaching one’s son a trade? And living off charity? And constantly lying and cheating? Are all these not part of the Jewish law that is supposed to be observed?
- But even if the facts were correct, and even if this were the right religion, the fact that it works for you does not justify abusing and exploiting others. If you rob me in order to rise in fear of Heaven, is that okay? And if you leave me to die for your sake because you want to continue studying Torah, is that okay?
I truly cannot understand how intelligent people can believe such absurd arguments.
Obviously, there are also advantages and positive qualities in Haredi society. The mistake is not in thinking that there are positive qualities there. The mistake is in thinking that the positive qualities justify the deficiencies. And again and again, people do not understand this.
Discussion on Answer
The education is distorted not because it educates toward Torah and Torah and Torah, but because of the content of the concept Torah. Defending the Jewish people and yourself along with them is a great commandment. So is that not Torah? And what about gratitude? Is that not Torah? And all the other examples I gave above.
Yes, נכון, it requires a new definition of concepts—what Torah is, what the value is, what the considerations are this way and that. All of that requires a change that, in my opinion, in order to happen has to be raised very strongly in public awareness, reaching all audiences and all the right people until it sinks in. But it would be naive of me to think that this will just happen on its own. It requires a lot of groundwork, from within. Some of it has already started, as I wrote above. From my personal experience, you need to approach audiences that are already more open-minded and that say whoever isn’t learning should enlist—and they are a much larger segment than people think. (Those who throw themselves on the road and shout “we will die and not enlist” / “the army of destruction,” in my opinion that’s already a lost cause…)
I’ll respond here briefly to Rabbi Michael’s words.
On point 1, he starts incorrectly: there is a lot of secularization there. That is of course not an argument, because even after all the secularization and the hidden coerced ones, it is still the society that observes commandments more than anyone else.
He continues by saying that it is not the right religion. He may be right, but he does not explain in what way it is not the right religion.
He claims this happens because of the support they receive from their surroundings. That is true, but it does not invalidate their path. He writes that this is a desecration of God’s name.
That is like clay in the hands of the potter: if the Haredim think that going to the army is equivalent to a decree of religious persecution,
then there is no claim of desecration of God’s name,
and in any case it is not distorted fear of Heaven.
Regarding the commandments he lists that the Haredim do not fulfill—again, if the price of maintaining defense of the land is abandonment of religion, it is not certain that one should do it.
As for teaching him a trade, perhaps there too, if the price is secularization, maybe it is preferable not to.
Regarding what he writes, that they cheat and lie all the time,
I don’t think Haredim are more deceitful than other populations.
Regarding what he claims in point 2, that you cannot do this at the expense of others, I’m not sure he is right, because a situation of religious persecution overrides everything, especially if it is about preserving the ember of the Jewish people.
So then it is no longer at others’ expense.
And
People ignore the fact that the question of the hidden coerced ones has further implications. A large portion of the Haredim work in jobs that require intention for the commandment, such as ritual slaughter and writing Torah scrolls, tefillin, and mezuzot, or they simply have communal roles like blowing the shofar and reading from the Torah. If a person is one of the hidden coerced ones and does not believe, it is not clear that one may eat from his slaughter, or fulfill one’s obligation with tefillin that he wrote, or with the blowing of the shofar that he blows.
I end up talking about this with lots of Haredim—some more open, some less—and the opinion that’s starting to become more and more widespread is: whoever isn’t learning should enlist. In the past there was absolute, fierce opposition to enlistment and to the army as such. In my opinion this will be a kind of evolution, where little by little it will sink in and people will understand and shift their views more and more in the direction of enlistment. And I also think that the more this is raised to public awareness and talked about, the more this process will accelerate. Let’s call it, for the sake of discussion, an “artificial consciousness shift,” instead of waiting for it to happen naturally.
As for the Rabbi’s puzzlement over how intelligent people can believe such arguments—usually those who believe this also believe other baseless things, like opposition to core curriculum studies. It’s also very hard to detach from a mindset that’s been instilled in you from infancy; it becomes part of you. That’s regarding the intelligent ones, but what about everyone else? All the “regular” people who just go with the flow and don’t examine anything? That’s the large segment in every population, regardless of religion—they make up at least 50 percent, if not more…
As for the positive qualities—think about someone who was educated only with “Torah, Torah, Torah.” From his perspective, the value of Torah is so exalted that even the defense of the state is a price worth paying. It’s very simple once you understand that. The whole idea is to explain that you can study Torah, and you can do everything else too, but at the same time also enlist, like the Religious Zionists. In the end it’s all a matter of education.