Q&A: A Haredi Claim
A Haredi Claim
Question
Where is the flaw in the following argument:
A Haredi person who says that he truly would have been willing to continue the situation that existed before the establishment of the State, and to absorb expulsions / pogroms as throughout the entire exile, and the fact that a state was established over his head is not his problem, and he does not want to participate in the obligations that exist in this state. And if you say: then should he also enjoy the benefits and the budgets? He is willing to accept that too, but what can he do if both the right and the left shower benefits on him in order to gain power? He is not obligated to run away from that; if the state denies him rights then he will absorb that too, but until then he enjoys what is ownerless…
Answer
This is a hypothetical question. If they want to set up a ghetto that does not benefit from the state, with no rights and no obligations, I am in favor of allowing them to do so. That is exactly what Lapid's proposed law offers: preventing them from voting and being elected and from receiving budgets. But about that they of course whine, true to form. We will die and not enlist—just don't cut off our budgets. They want to die with full stomachs.
Discussion on Answer
You certainly will find a Haredi person who declares that he really would have been willing to continue the situation that existed before the establishment of the State, etc. But? Every such Haredi person—and there are many of them—is l-y-i-n-g.
I'm not sure. This is an argument that basically says the obligation to change the situation rests on the state. From their perspective, they are basically exploiting the situation just as Jews did throughout the generations (and maybe that's why they weren't liked). What I'm saying does not contradict the fact that their argument is contrary to the Torah, and of course only thanks to the state do they have security and quiet.
I was responding to the Rabbi's answer and would be glad to get a reply…
Today at the demonstration, a Haredi young man decided to demonstrate the Haredi slogan and died without enlisting.
The precise Haredi slogan is: "You will die and we will not enlist."