Conventions and Rational Truths: The Public’s Role in Shaping Values (Column 177)
With God’s help
This past Sabbath we studied a passage in Ein Ayah, and it shed light for me on what Maimonides writes at the beginning of his Guide of the Perplexed about Adam’s sin. The matter naturally also connects to the Torah portion of Bereshit, which we read that same Sabbath. Maimonides there distinguishes between conventions and rational truths, and I wanted to reflect on that distinction and point out that it is not quite so sharp.
Maimonides’ remarks
In Guide of the Perplexed Part I, chapter 2, Maimonides raises a difficulty about Adam’s sin:
A certain wise man raised with me, years ago, a great difficulty. One must reflect on the difficulty and on our answers in resolving it… The plain sense of the verse seems to indicate that man’s original intention was to be like the other living creatures, without intellect or thought, and unable to distinguish between good and evil. But when he rebelled, his rebellion brought him this great perfection unique to man—namely, this faculty of cognition found in us, which is the noblest of the qualities found in us, and by which we are constituted as what we are. Yet it would be astonishing if the punishment for his rebellion were to grant him a perfection he had not previously possessed, namely intellect. That would be like saying that a certain man rebelled and committed grave wrongdoing, and therefore his nature was changed for the better and he was set as a star in the heavens.
The narrative describes Adam and Eve as receiving the “punishment” of knowing how to distinguish between good and evil. Maimonides asks how such a thing could be a punishment. After all, their understanding was enhanced as a result of the sin.
He answers:
…for the intellect that the Creator bestowed upon man, which is his ultimate perfection, was granted to man before his rebellion, and because of it it was said of him that he was in the image of God and in His likeness. Because of it, God spoke to him and commanded him, as it says, “And the Lord God commanded”; for commandments are not given to animals or to one who has no intellect. By means of intellect, man distinguishes between truth and falsehood, and this was present in him in complete perfection. But what is disgraceful or fitting belongs to the realm of convention, not intellect: one does not say, “It is fitting that the heavens are spherical,” or “It is disgraceful that the earth is flat,” but rather, “true” and “false.” Likewise, in our language one says of what is correct and what is void, “true” and “false,” and of what is fitting and disgraceful, “good” and “evil.” Through intellect man knows truth from falsehood, and this applies to all intelligible matters. When man was in the perfection and completeness of his state, together with the thought and intellect because of which it was said of him, “You made him little lower than God,” he had no capacity whatsoever to employ conventional categories or grasp them. So much so that even the most obvious case of disgrace according to convention—namely, nakedness—was not disgraceful in his eyes, and he did not perceive its shame. But when he rebelled and inclined toward his imaginative desires and the pleasures of his bodily senses, as it says, “that the tree was good for food and a delight to the eyes,” he was punished by losing that intellectual apprehension. It was because of this that he rebelled against the commandment, which had been given to him precisely on account of his intellect; and then he acquired awareness of conventional categories and sank into perceptions of shame and attractiveness. Then he understood the measure of what he had lost, what had been stripped from him, and in what state he had come to be. Therefore it says, “and you shall be like God, knowing good and evil,” and it does not say, “knowing falsehood and truth,” or “grasping falsehood and truth,” for good and evil do not belong to necessary truths at all, but truth and falsehood do. Reflect also on the verse, “And the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked.” It does not say, “and the eyes of both of them were opened, and they saw,” because what they saw before is what they saw afterward; there was no blindness upon the eye that was removed. Rather, something else was newly generated in them, through which they found shame in what they had not previously regarded as shameful…
He explains that before the sin, Adam and Eve knew how to distinguish between truth and falsehood and understood rational truths. But the category of conventions did not yet exist for them. That entered their world only after the sin. He adds that, in effect, their intellectual apprehension of truth and falsehood was taken from them, and in its place they sank into conventions, that is, into the seemly and the unseemly, which are measured in terms of good and evil.
What are the “conventions”?
Maimonides here distinguishes between factual claims and other kinds of claims. Factual claims are examined in terms of truth or falsehood (that is how Aristotle defined a proposition). But the unseemly and the seemly are not judged in terms of truth and falsehood. Therefore these are conventions, not rational truths. But here Maimonides links good and evil to the seemly and the unseemly, and includes all of them under the heading of conventions.
At first glance, it appears that he classifies moral and evaluative claims (good and evil) under the heading of conventions. If so, then in his view these are not factual claims that can be judged in terms of truth and falsehood, but conventions judged in terms of good and evil. But this understanding of his words is puzzling. In many places Maimonides treats moral principles as part of the intellect, and a moral person as wise. For example, in chapter 6 of the Eight Chapters he distinguishes between rational commandments and revealed commandments. That is, moral commandments are, in his view, part of the intellect.
It seems that here he does not mean moral claims but claims of etiquette and modes of conduct. Table manners and social conventions are conventions, “accepted notions.” Their validity derives from social agreement. Maimonides says of them that doing X or not doing Y is good or bad, like seemly or unseemly. But it seems that his intention here is not good and evil in the sense used with respect to moral claims, but rather in the conventional sense of the seemly and the unseemly. Maimonides is essentially saying that there is value in behaving in a civilized way that is accepted in the society in which we live, and therefore one can also say of such actions that they are good or bad. But these are not absolute values like moral values; they are values dependent on society and on social conventions.[1]
The most striking example he gives here of conventions is going about without clothes. That was the state of Adam and Eve before the sin. At that stage they did not perceive this as unseemly, and that understanding was born in them only after the sin. Awareness of conventions was created in them after the sin, and that was their punishment. But if so, it is still not clear why this is a fitting punishment for a sin. After all, a mode of perception was added to them that they had not had before (Maimonides did not say that it is unworthy to behave in accordance with conventions). It seems that his point is that before the sin, walking without clothes really was not bad. A state in which there are no conventions is a more perfect state. True, once conventions exist one must behave in accordance with them and not separate oneself from the community. But the very condition in which there are conventions and not only rational truths or morality is an inferior one, and that is what came into being after the sin. That is why this is a punishment. Before the sin, the norm accepted among them was to walk naked, and therefore there was nothing bad about it. What came into being after the sin was the very convention that one should not walk that way; more precisely, what came into being was the very obligation to conform to social conventions. That in itself is an inferior state, since, as noted, he writes that this came at the price of a retreat on the intellectual plane. But once such a state has come into being, one must obey those conventions.
The meaning of moral claims
If so, in his view moral claims are not conventions, and they are judged in terms of truth or falsehood. This indicates that, in his opinion, there is a binding moral truth. In factual claims, the way to judge their truth or falsehood is to compare the content of the claim to the state of affairs in the world that it describes. If there is correspondence, the claim is true; if not, it is false. But what comparison can be made with respect to moral values? Against what does one measure a moral claim in order to determine whether it is true or false?
This is why many retreat to the view that morality is some sort of social convention, one of the “conventions,” and this seemingly takes us back to Maimonides’ words above. But, as noted, I think his intention here is not morality but social and etiquette conventions. Morality, in his view, belongs to the realm of rational truths.
In my book Emet Ve-lo Yatziv and in the fourth booklet, I argued that what emerges from here is moral realism, that is, that there is something in reality that we apprehend in order to discern what is good and what is not. That object is not a physical object, of course, but an ideal object. One may say that this is the Idea of the good or of morality. Nor is the observation of it done with the eyes or the senses, but with the eyes of the intellect (“the eyes of the intellect”)—again, Maimonides’ own terminology in those very chapters of the Guide of the Perplexed, especially chapter 4—that is, through moral intuition (conscience). This is an intellectual contemplation of morality. If seeing with one’s eyes is considered something maximally objective, something difficult to dispute, then this sort of contemplation is very subjective, and of course there are quite a few disputes regarding its products (moral values and their application). That is why some see it—and morality in general—as something subjective or as a mere convention. But that is not so.
What follows from my remarks is that inserting morality into the category of conventions is a kind of category mistake, rooted in an unwillingness to accept that there is something there to be apprehended and that morality can have objective meaning. In Rav Kook’s words cited above there is a further hint that morality is a kind of intermediate category between conventions and rational truths, and that is what I want to address here.
Two kinds of “many”
A Talmudic passage in Berakhot 6a deals with the indwelling of the Divine Presence among a group. Here I cite only the part that concerns us:
And from where do we know that when ten pray, the Divine Presence is with them? For it is said: “God stands in the congregation of God.” And from where do we know that when three sit in judgment, the Divine Presence is with them? For it is said: “In the midst of judges He judges”… But if even three suffice, is there any need to mention ten? With ten, the Divine Presence comes first and is already present; with three, only once they are seated..
The Talmud here says that the Divine Presence rests upon ten Jews, but also upon three (and even upon one; see the passage there). In the end, the Talmud distinguishes between two situations: with ten, the Divine Presence rests immediately (regardless of what they are occupied with, even before they pray), whereas with three it rests only at the time of judgment and not beforehand (see Rashi there).
Rav Kook writes the following about this:
There are matters for which three are considered a majority, such as legal cases and the blessing of the zimmun, and the like. And there are matters for which ten are considered the many and constitute the full required number, and no fewer.
He asks why in some contexts only ten count as “many,” whereas in other contexts three suffice. To explain this he opens with the distinction between conventions and rational truths that we have already encountered:
And the root of the difference appears to be as follows: there are two kinds of conduct in which a person must walk on the good and upright path, which is the path of God, bringing honor to those who practice it and honor to him from others. That is, in intellectual matters, whose categories are truth and falsehood; and in conventional matters, whose categories are good and evil, or fitting and disgraceful.
It is easy to see that the terminology is borrowed from Maimonides, of course.
He now explains how this distinction bears on our issue:
And the difference is this: with regard to truth and falsehood, since man has no power to determine the boundary of truth definitively, he must in every doubtful judgment follow the majority. Therefore, in intellectual matters and judgments, three constitute a majority, for they have the power of decision, since a court cannot be evenly balanced. But in matters of convention, whose whole basis is general agreement, for this purpose the many are no fewer than ten; ten are the basic unit of the many with respect to publicly accepted consensus.
Now, among people who walk in the upright path, regarding conventional matters there is no doubt that what they agree is fitting is truly fitting, and what they agree is disgraceful is truly disgraceful. Therefore, an individual may not separate from the community in any way. But regarding the distinction between truth and falsehood, one cannot say that the minority can never hit upon the truth; rather, once the majority has decided in one direction, the minority is obligated to set aside its view. Therefore, with regard to three judges, only once they are seated and the majority has decided in favor of one side does the Divine Presence come, and the divine influence then accords with the decision. But with ten, the Divine Presence comes first and is already present; there is no need for a decision to generate it. For what is publicly accepted by the many is so in itself in matters of convention, and there is no need for a formal decision to say that only then is the matter determined..
In intellectual and judicial matters there is an objective truth, one that does not depend on the forum that determines it. The majority within the forum is only an indication that this is the truth, but even if they are mistaken, the truth does not change. The majority can of course be wrong. The reason we follow the majority in questions of truth and falsehood is only because the majority is an indication that this is the truth, though of course not an absolute indication (see columns 66, 69 and 79). By contrast, in questions of the seemly and the unseemly—that is, conventions—the majority determines and constitutes the truth, and does not merely indicate it. What the majority says is the truth, because we are dealing with conventional truth (= conventions). In such contexts, the public convention is the truth itself.
Therefore, Rav Kook explains, when three sit in judgment, their mere presence there is no guarantee that truth will emerge from them. The Divine Presence rests only on the decision that emerges from them (which is also reached by majority view). Those three are perhaps “many,” but they are not a public. Their purpose is not to establish a convention but to decide what the truth is. For that, three suffice. Therefore the Divine Presence does not rest upon the three until a decision is reached, since only then does truth emerge from them (and even if not, the Divine Presence rests upon that decision because it is written Follow the majority (‘follow the majority’), and from our perspective the majority is itself the legal truth). But with ten who have gathered to pray, we are dealing with a public and not merely with many individuals. A public exists only from ten and up. The public establishes binding conventions, and therefore what is involved here is conventions. As we saw, conventions are determined essentially by the public. It is the public that constitutes them. Even if not by the entire public, then by a majority that counts as the whole. Therefore with ten there is no need to wait for a decision in order for the Divine Presence to rest. Whatever the decision may be, the very gathering of the public brings the Divine Presence, because with respect to conventions the public has a constitutive status. This does not depend on what they decide (that is, whether they hit upon the truth) but on the mere fact of their being a public.[2]
Therefore, in Jewish law an individual is permitted to depart from the majority decision, since a majority in a religious court does not essentially determine the truth. As the Talmud states in Horayot 2 (one who errs regarding the commandment to heed the words of the Sages — “one who errs regarding the commandment to heed the sages”), an individual need not obey a religious court that has erred. If they erred, that is not the truth. But separating from the public is not an option. The public determination itself (with respect to conventions) is the truth. Therefore there the majority determines matters essentially, and one may not separate from it. Ironically, it is precisely in questions in which truth is not what determines matters that the obligation to follow the majority is absolute. In questions of truth and falsehood, the majority is an indication, but there is no absolute obligation to adhere to it.
I should note here that Rav Kook’s distinction resembles the distinction I presented in column 66 between a democratic majority, which constitutes the truth, and a majority in a religious court, which tries to hit upon the truth (and this is what is learned from Follow the majority).[3] In the democratic-political context, the majority is not an indication of the truth; it is the truth itself, unlike in a religious court, where the majority is only an indication that this is the truth.
What are the “conventions” according to Rav Kook?
A further look at Rav Kook’s words shows that he too understood, as I suggested above, that when Maimonides spoke of conventions he did not mean norms of morality or Jewish law (good and evil), but only conventions (the seemly and the unseemly), which by their nature are determined by the public. Moral principles (good and evil), as well as halakhic rulings, belong to the realm of rational truths, and that is what the religious court deals with. All these are judged in terms of truth or falsehood (and not of unseemly and seemly).
The moral and halakhic category: the problem of terminology
Even if we accept this interpretation of “conventions,” one cannot deny that Rav Kook’s and Maimonides’ terminology is problematic. It contains ambiguity and lack of clarity. The unseemly and the seemly are clearly conventions. Factual claims clearly belong to truth and falsehood. But in both of them, the terms good and evil express only the unseemly and the seemly (and stand in contrast to truth and falsehood). As we saw, moral principles, which for us are usually associated with good and evil, belong for them to the axis of truth and falsehood. But if so, then their use of the terms good and evil as though these were synonymous with the unseemly and the seemly, in opposition to truth and falsehood, is strange and calls for explanation. Good and evil usually refer to the ethical plane.
It seems to me that this terminology reflects a widespread intuition regarding moral norms. They really do concern truth and falsehood (there is a right and a wrong there), but nevertheless there is something conventional about them, that is, a component that depends on social agreement. We saw above that many regard moral norms as conventions. And we also saw that Maimonides and Rav Kook probably do not think so, yet their terminology still points to some sort of kinship between moral and halakhic norms and the unseemly and the seemly as well, even though they are not simple conventions. This is an intermediate category between the truth-falsehood axis and the unseemly-seemly axis. It contains elements of both.
And indeed, above we saw that at the basis of morality too there is some kind of observation, which is why it belongs to truth and falsehood, but we also saw that this is not simple sensory observation. I explained that Maimonides sees it as observation with the eyes of the intellect. So what is that conventional component in the moral context? This is certainly not convention in the full consensual sense, for if it were, we would empty morality of its force. But still, the confusing terminology and the intuition as well hint that society has some role in the moral context. On the face of it, there is a sense that morality is something between truth and falsehood (the objective, which does not depend on public agreement or majority decision) and the unseemly and the seemly (the conventional, which depends on public agreement or majority).
Public influence on the individual’s values
When we studied these things, I thought that perhaps one could understand this intuition and terminology as follows. Society really does have a role in the moral context. Although this is not a convention (like the seemly and the unseemly), it is hard to ignore the fact that society does indeed influence our moral perception. There is, of course, a very broad common moral foundation across all societies, but there are also differences. Different societies perceive at least some moral principles differently. And the individuals who belong to them are very much influenced by the conceptions accepted in their society.
Moreover, even within the same society there is moral change over time. What is perceived in a given society as bad at one point may become good or neutral at another. Take, for example, the questions of slavery, abortion, gender equality, homosexuality, democracy and civil rights, individualism, sexual harassment, and more—things whose moral status has changed very deeply over the years. That same society has reversed itself with respect to these values, and therefore it is hard to claim that the individual’s perception is unrelated to the norms accepted in his society.
Of course, one can propose two technical mechanisms for these phenomena that strip them of significance:
- One can say that there is really no influence from the public to individuals; rather, this is a mechanism in which individuals change their position for some reason (a renewed contemplation of the Idea of the good), and when enough change accumulates, a social change arises at the macro level.
- One can also say that there are influences from the public to individuals, but these are non-substantive influences (brainwashing, propaganda, conformism, fashions—political correctness and the like).
But my feeling is that there is something deeper here. People really do change their views under the influence of society, but this is not a non-substantive process, and it also does not necessarily point to the subjectivity of values.
A proposed solution
I think that contemplation of the Idea of the good—the one that yields our judgments and our distinction between good and evil—is itself carried out publicly. The one who observes values and forms positions regarding them is the public, with the individual included in it, and therefore the individual’s view of good and evil is influenced by the society in which he lives. He is influenced by the general norms of his society, and of course also by its positions regarding the specific topic under discussion. My claim is that this is not necessarily brainwashing or political correctness, and it is also not necessarily conformism (as in explanation b above). But there is something that goes from the public to the individual and not only from the individual to the public (as in explanation a there). My claim is that what we have here is a process that is essentially public. The public shapes a moral worldview. The observation with the eyes of the intellect is carried out publicly, and therefore every individual within it who forms a position does so in a way that is not independent of the public. The public helps us distinguish between good and evil and shape our values. In this context, the public functions as a sophisticated havruta (study partner). We study ethical issues within the framework of public discourse and response, and thus change our values.
In my view, this is why people feel that if their values are not accepted by the public at large, they require examination. Public acceptance is regarded as an important measure of the correctness of values, and therefore it is no wonder that some see values as social conventions. But according to my proposal, although there is something to this, it is not an accurate description. The public is not the source of the convention but rather a “study partner” that helps me contemplate correctly. On the other hand, we tend to accuse those who adapt themselves to the spirit of the public of conformism, which is of course sometimes true. But in my opinion that too is not necessarily correct. Because of the built-in ambiguity of this non-sensory “observation,” the process needs to be public. The individual needs confirmation that others too see things as he does, and only then is he convinced that he has indeed observed correctly. This is public confirmation of his evaluative perceptions. Therefore the spirit prevailing in society contributes to the shaping of the individual’s views. As noted, this does not necessarily point either to conformism or to the subjectivity and conventionality of values.
Is the public always right?
None of this means that the public is always right, or that the individual may not allow himself to disagree with accepted conceptions. On the contrary, he must stand his ground in order to create a real debate. Only where there is a real debate does the conclusion of the debate, and the public spirit that emerges from it, have force. That is how complex issues are clarified. It is no accident that Rav Kook speaks of halakhic truth as something that the majority does indeed determine, but without certainty that the majority is correct. There are situations in which the minority is right. But every individual must take the spirit of the public into account. Not in order to be a conformist, but to use it in forming a correct evaluative stance. On the one hand, he must stand his ground; on the other hand, he must look seriously at the spirit accepted in the public in order to examine his positions carefully and shape them.
For example, the dilemma raised in this thread (regarding abortion) reflects the tension felt by a person who stands against the values accepted in his society. Has he still failed to grasp something, so that he must reexamine his positions (drawing on the spirit of the public), or is it rather the public that is mistaken, so that he must fight for his views and not yield? Sometimes a person yields to that spirit, but as I wrote there, even if I think he is mistaken I would not necessarily judge him negatively. The fact that this is the prevailing spirit in a substantial part of society constitutes a mitigating circumstance.
Moral and scientific progress
If values are not mere agreement, then changes in them are not simply the replacement of one fashion with another. Such change is supposed to be a kind of progress toward fuller and deeper ethical truth. By way of comparison, one should note that even in the scientific context, at least in complex issues, the agreement of the scientific community matters. Thomas Kuhn, the philosopher-sociologist of science, sees this as “scientific politics,” because he understands theory as a paradigm whose validity derives from the agreement of the scientific community. That is mere convention, and its replacement is essentially a change of fashion. I disagree with him on this. In my opinion, this is progress and recognition that the previous paradigm was mistaken. One should remember that even in scientific research we are dealing with generalizations and not with simple sensory observations, and because of the ambiguity and complexity of this mechanism, the individual scientist expects public confirmation for his proposals and views. Public acceptance is a measure that helps us reach conclusions in complicated and non-univocal situations. Therefore, in my view, a change in theory and paradigm reflects scientific progress. The community sees that the fuller and deeper scientific picture is different from what they had thought until now. And again, there is not necessarily room here for criticism in terms of conformism or surrender to fashions.
My claim is that this is also the explanation for changes in the evaluative and moral norms that occur in different societies. Public contemplation suddenly discovers that there was a mistake and that the conceptions need to be updated. This is not necessarily fashion or merely conventional change; sometimes it is moral progress. As in the scientific context, it is difficult for a private individual to discern this, and the shift in the public outlook is what gives validation to the collection of feelings held by isolated individuals that this is indeed progress—that is, a more correct and deeper ethical understanding.
Back to conventions and rational truths: an intermediate category
This is my proposal for understanding morality as an intermediate category between conventions (the seemly and the unseemly) and rational truths (the true and the false). In morality, society has a role (as in relation to the seemly and the unseemly), but there is still moral truth (unlike in relation to the seemly and the unseemly). In this context, the public spirit does not constitute the truth (as in relation to the seemly and the unseemly) but helps reveal it (as in relation to truth and falsehood). That is why the confusion arises that identifies morality with convention. There is something correct in this, but it is interpreted incorrectly. It is not really a convention, because here the public is an indication of the truth and does not constitute it. In Rav Kook’s terms, this is similar to what happens in a religious court and not to what happens in a congregation/prayer quorum/public.
The obligation not to separate oneself from the public exists also with respect to the seemly and the unseemly, but there it is because the public’s position constitutes the seemly and the unseemly. That obligation exists in a certain sense also with respect to morality, but there it is only an indication of good and evil, not that the public position constitutes them. Therefore, when necessary, in moral contexts one certainly should separate from the public, and not be someone who is one who errs regarding the commandment to heed the words of the Sages (“mistaken in obeying the sages”), or mistaken in yielding to majority opinion.
Moral progress
Several times in the past I have written against moral relativism. It is usually based on the fact that there are evaluative differences between different societies, and that a society’s evaluative conceptions change over time. To reject that claim, I used as an illustration what usually happens in encounters between East and West. The fact is that Western values usually spread at the expense of Eastern values (see the list of such values above). Some attribute this to Western dominance and its use of coercive processes, but I do not agree. That exists too, of course, but there is also recognition that these values are more correct. With apologies for the condescension and Western hubris, in such encounters there is a directionality, and this points to an axis that traces the direction of moral-evaluative progress.
My claim is that conservative societies that encounter such values recognize that there is something correct about them (even if not fully, and even if the liberal West sometimes takes them too far), and therefore generally adopt them. The illusion of relativism and moral subjectivity created by the multiplicity of moral conceptions in different societies is mistaken. The multiplicity of conceptions exists because this is a complex and non-univocal “observation.” The process of progress requires discourse, discussion, and working things through in a broad public arena. But the fact is that there is a direction of progress, and this hints that we are dealing with a process of development and advance, not with conventions—mere arbitrary agreements.
[1] There is room to examine the connection between this distinction and the question whether there are rules of morality that do not harm others. See on this in column 154 (on aesthetic values). I think there is not necessarily an identity here, and this is not the place for that.
[2] To be sure, in the straightforward sense of the Talmud this is speaking about the gathering of a prayer quorum for prayer, and therefore the connection to conventions is not the Talmud’s direct meaning. Here I am discussing Rav Kook’s interpretation of the Talmud and its significance, without expressing any opinion about how well it fits the straightforward meaning of the Talmud.
[3] I showed there, from the words of the medieval authorities (Rishonim), that a constitutive majority is indeed not learned from the verse Follow the majority (which deals with a truth-seeking majority) in its plain sense. It is an extension based on reasoning. Therefore, in our context too, following the majority rests on a different principle from the one that operates in a religious court.
Discussion
I didn’t understand the message here. It sounds like the talk of a mashgiach (sorry). Where does the connection between liberalism and hedonism come from? Is concern for others and their rights hedonism? Is fighting for democracy and equality hedonism? And besides, religion too can serve as opium for the masses and answer dark needs.
Interesting.
But it doesn’t seem to me that this is Maimonides’ intention, since he explicitly writes that “beautiful and ugly” belongs only to accepted conventions, whereas we do know that “beautiful and ugly” also applies in morality (alongside truth and falsehood).
How does liberalism work?
Liberalism identifies a human desire and turns it into a right. People have a desire for equality. In practice, people are not equal, and reason suggests that different factors should receive different treatment. But people’s desire for equality does not allow them to accept the logic, and so they create the right to equality. Another example is what is called a woman’s right over her own body. Women have a desire for sexual liberation that will free them from commitment to a relationship with one man. But sexual liberation has a price — pregnancy. In every generation, that price signaled that perhaps it was better to give up sexual liberation in favor of a monogamous relationship. In our generation this is no longer acceptable, yet the basic desire remains to be freed from the moral and technical obligation to the baby in the womb. Don’t worry — liberalism will find a solution; it’s called a woman’s right over her body. The woman can abort the fetus and there is no problem.
One could go on and on, showing how what are called rights are nothing but human desires clothed in a respectable guise as rights: the right to life, property, the welfare state, homosexuality, and so on and so forth. There is no truly rational, intellectual matter here, only blind impulse.
Science has nothing to say about our goals. Technology comes to serve them, but when the desires are blind, anything can happen. Technology will serve the desire for life and the desire for death; the desire for good deeds and the desire for evil deeds. Anything goes.
Liberalism tends to wrap itself in a cloak of morality, but if you peel it away you will discover the hedonism at its base. This is not a moral system but hedonism that has conquered the world. And therefore I would not be quick to embrace the idea of progress.
It turns out that sometimes even mashgichim have something of value to say.
P.S. I once thought to prove progress from changes in languages, but that really requires quite a few preliminaries, and this is not the place to spell them out.
Just to note that Rav Kook thinks that even in accepted conventions (aesthetic values) there is truth and falsehood. He writes: “Now, regarding people who walk on an upright path, in matters of accepted conventions there is no doubt that what they agree is beautiful is truly beautiful, and what they agree is ugly is truly ugly.” He is saying that there is such a thing as something beautiful (and likewise ugly) “in truth.” And the majority’s decision about what is beautiful can be beautiful “in truth” or not (that is, directed toward an external objective reality). And this also depends on their “walking on an upright path”—that is, that their moral sense (the morality he is talking about, the intermediate category) is developed. And perhaps he also means that they know how to think straight and not crookedly (that they possess critical sense), which is already something that relates to intelligibles proper.
It should be said (and I indeed say this myself as well) that in Rav Kook’s view everything belongs to the realm of intelligibles, only there are different levels of it, level above level. In fact, accepted conventions and intelligibles are two poles on one axis, where the end-point of accepted conventions is “banal intelligibles,” whose truth is hard to reach because it may depend on taste, which is a kind of relation between the inner world of a specific person and external objective reality. And that inner world too is a kind of objective reality, like a blood type or DNA. In fact, about taste and smell one can perhaps argue meaningfully, except that one must know well the person with whom one is arguing. That is, one can argue whether for a specific person something ought to appear beautiful or not, assuming one knows him and that one oneself has a developed aesthetic sense of one’s own. And an object is “beautiful” in someone’s eyes if there is indeed some core of general objective reality (an idea) of beauty in it (the object) plus a layer constituted by that person’s inner structure that is specifically suited to this object.
In the essay you distinguish among three categories: statements of fact, whose validity derives from correspondence to reality.
Moral statements, whose validity derives from correspondence to the objective moral idea.
Statements of accepted conventions (social conventions), all of whose validity derives from the very fact that the public agrees to them.
You try to explain the ambiguity in Maimonides’ distinction between morality and conventions by saying that morality too has a public aspect, in that the public is an indication and good study partner for drawing closer to moral truth.
According to your understanding, that all the validity of convention is the agreement of the public:
1. It is still not clear what the punishment is in the recognition of conventions.
2. By what force do accepted conventions obligate? Is it a scriptural decree that one must accept conventions, or is it a moral judgment saying that one must accept conventions?
3. Are conventions completely arbitrary, and therefore, by chance, after the sin of the tree of knowledge, the first convention created was not to walk around naked—but an entirely different convention could have developed out of the infinite possibilities; with equal force the convention could have been accepted that one must walk around with a Flying Spaghetti Monster hat?
It seems to me that Maimonides should be interpreted a bit differently.
Certainly Maimonides distinguishes between morality and accepted conventions, and the recognition of morality as the recognition of truth and falsehood, and a person who does not recognize morality is more blind and less complete. But conventions are laws that arise because of a need created by the diminished state of human beings after the sin.
In the act of sin, man descended from his intellectual level in that he began to follow his bodily urges and passions even when they lacked any intellectual purpose. And because of this deficiency, this surrender to impulse, man began to be ashamed of his inferiority, and so an agreed-upon law was created out of the need to restrain the sexual impulse by covering the private parts.
The punishment is the diminution of man’s intellectual side, and the creation of conventions is only a response to that state of deficiency, not the punishment itself.
The response that man creates by forming conventions is indeed not true in itself in the way morality is true, but it is not arbitrary. The convention itself of not going around naked is not a value in itself, but walking after the intellect and not after impulse is an objective value, which the convention of not going around naked serves.
It follows that the common denominator and the root of the lack of distinction between conventions and morality is that accepted conventions too contain something moral, in that they serve moral values.
Your claim that the evidence for moral progress is that we see the movement of influence of values going in one direction—for example, the adoption of Western values in the East and not the reverse—
according to this it would also follow that conceptions of denial of God,
materialism, and determinism, which are conquering more and more of the world and of the scientific world (see the field known as “brain science”), and we do not see the direction of influence moving the other way, mean that your entire enterprise, which fights against the wind, is going in the wrong direction?
In Shemonah Perakim, ch. 5: “That is, the ‘evils’ of which the philosophers said that one who does not desire them is superior to one who desires them and subdues his inclination—these are the things universally accepted among all people as ‘evils.’
For example: bloodshed, theft, anger, faintheartedness, harming one who has done no harm, repaying evil to one who has done good, dishonoring parents, and the like….”
Guide of the Perplexed II:33 — regarding the Ten Commandments: “However, they also have a statement written in many places in the Midrashim, and it is also in the Talmud, namely their saying: ‘”I am” and “You shall have no other gods”—they heard from the mouth of the Almighty.’ By this they mean that these reached them in the same way that they reached Moses our teacher, and Moses our teacher did not convey them to them. This is because these two principles—I mean, the existence of God and His oneness—are apprehended by human speculation. And everything known by demonstration—the judgment of the prophet concerning it and the judgment of anyone else who knows it—are equal; there is no superiority. And these two principles were not known only through prophecy—the Torah says, ‘You have been shown, to know,’ etc. But the rest of the commandments are of the class of accepted conventions and traditions, not of the class of intelligibles.”
So we have here that, according to Maimonides, accepted conventions—even basic morality
To Moshe,
“Accepted conventions” in our context stands in contrast to intelligibles. The “accepted things” in Shemonah Perakim are the agreed-upon things (those about which there is no dispute, but not conventions). As for the Guide, indeed the terminology requires examination. In any case, it is clear that in his view moral prohibitions are not conventions, and even in the Guide there is no necessity to say otherwise. We are speaking of something whose basis is not philosophical inquiry but self-evident things.
I disagree. This is just tendentious way of looking at it. In the Torah too you could say that a person has a desire for property, and therefore property is turned into a value and a right. He has a desire for honor, and therefore humiliating him is forbidden. And so on. Those same mashgichim already said that your fellow’s this-world is your world-to-come.
I didn’t understand. With regard to morality there is no beautiful and ugly, only good and evil.
Quite apart from your suggestion, the linguistic precision means nothing. It is beautiful by definition. That is not a claim but a definition. This also emerges from the content of his passage. According to your interpretation, it has no meaning.
To Yaakov,
1. The punishment is that instead of conducting ourselves according to reason, we conduct ourselves according to conventions. The very emergence of the sphere of conventions is itself the punishment.
2-3. Once that sphere has come into being, there is value in not deviating from the accepted etiquette in society. Holding the knife on the right and the fork on the left could indeed have been established the other way around. And still, there is a point to not being exceptional and strange. There is value in not separating oneself from the community (as Rav Kook wrote).
What you are proposing is exactly what I said.
Indeed, even heresy has value (and Rav Kook wrote this in several places). It comes to free us from the primitive religious conceptions that were practiced (and still are) before it. Rebelling against them is a proper value.
First, even the materialist and determinist outlook contains something true. This comes to exclude all sorts of paganisms that attribute natural phenomena to dark mysticism. Science develops only thanks to those outlooks (though they must still be qualified and kept in their proper place). Second, as I wrote, the majority is not always right, and a person should fight for his view if he thinks he is right. Still, one should pay attention to an intuition prevalent among the public when formulating a position. At the end of the discussion, which is still ongoing, we will probably arrive at the correct view.
Because “beautiful and ugly” is also used in the sense of “good and evil” (especially in the Arabic original; see the note in Schwartz’s translation).
Likewise, in The Treatise on Logic, gate 8, Maimonides gives two examples of “accepted conventions”: 1. exposing the nakedness, 2. repaying good to one who has done good to you. And it seems to me that with respect to example 2 one cannot argue that this is an entirely moral matter. And it is somewhat forced to say that Maimonides changed the definition of “accepted conventions” when writing the Guide without bringing clear evidence for that change.
I agree that accepted conventions like holding the fork in the right hand, or any convention that seems pointless to us today, the only reason there is any point in acting accordingly is just public agreement.
I don’t understand why you insist, regarding conventions such as not walking around naked, where we can easily see the absolute logic and reason in them regardless of public convention, on giving them validity only because of public agreement.
After all, it is easy to understand why the public chose this convention.
If the public chose this convention, apparently there is a reason for this rule.
And if there is a reason for the rule, then the reason is what obligates, not the public.
The agreeing public is only an indication that the reason for the agreed-upon rule is correct and suited to the time and place.
Yaakov, your complaint is not with me but with Maimonides.
(If this is the only possible interpretation in Maimonides, then why is Maimonides so important to me—or to you—if it seems to me to be a strange idea?)
Maimonides can easily be interpreted אחרת,
as I suggested, that the accepted conventions are not the punishment but the fact that we need to create conventions because we have descended from our intellectual level; the need for conventions is the punishment, not our obligation itself to pointless conventions.
After we have descended from our level, there is good reason for each of our conventions, and the reason is what obligates.
Yaakov, hello.
It seems to me that this is a dialogue of the deaf. We’ve exhausted it.
I would direct the question to Maimonides if he were alive, but perhaps you can help me. How does his interpretation of the Garden of Eden myth fit with the continuation of the verses: “And the Lord God said, Behold, the man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he stretch out his hand and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”? It seems that the serpent was right (not only in that they did not die), and Adam and Eve really did become more “godlike” after eating, and knowledge of good and evil was a trait that belonged only to God beforehand. How does that fit with accepted conventions?
Indeed, it seems that his interpretation does not fit the plain meaning.
And perhaps liberalism is a kind of moral temptation that must be resisted? A choice to unleash the dark sides of man, which in the end will bring destruction upon the human species. Historically, liberalism is rooted in heresy that underwent a political twist. Instead of seeking the happiness of the individual by liberation from belief in the gods, it proposed a method whereby all of us would act together to increase the maximization of happiness through technology. The fact that technology can increase social harm (as Rashi writes about Tubal-Cain, the forger of every cutting instrument of bronze and iron, that he “seasoned” Cain’s craft) was pushed aside by liberal thinkers. Medicine can prolong life, but it can also shorten the life of the fetus and enable organ harvesting in China. War in the past claimed far fewer lives than modern war. Genetic engineering enables increased crop yields, but it also threatens the development of bacteria that could kill us all. As someone once wrote, technology is a sword without a hilt, which can destroy us just as it prolongs our days, and is guided solely by the passions of the masses.
We are traveling in a driverless car that can take us to the peaks or plunge us into the depths, and we have no control over it. The adoption of liberalism can be explained by its moral superiority, but equally as the victory of passions, and I at least have no criterion by which to decide.