חדש באתר: עוזר בינה מלאכותית המבוסס על כתביו ושיעוריו של הרב מיכאל אברהם

Q&A: Our God and the God of Our Mothers

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Originally published:
This is an English translation (via GPT-5.4). Read the original Hebrew version.

Our God and the God of Our Mothers

Question

Hello Rabbi,
Regarding changes in the wording of the prayer service:
If I’m not mistaken, the Rabbi has written at length about prayer in our time in terms of its length and archaic style, and in terms of the usefulness of some of the requests in the prayers.
It seems to me that you haven’t addressed innovations that modern communities are trying to incorporate into the prayer service. Even if these innovations don’t add anything for you, it seems to me that there are broad audiences whom these additions draw closer. My question is how you view these additions, when they contradict Jewish law (“whoever changes the coinage established by the Sages”), and when they do not contradict it, but they bring in new winds and values.
I’m writing this בעקבות the campaign that came out before Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur for the machzor “Poteach Sha’ar,” which is advertised as a prayer book that integrates new ideas and egalitarianism, etc. I’m attaching a link:
https://www.masorti.org.il/page.php?pid=21
 
As an example, I’m attaching an alternative “Prayer for Rain for Simchat Torah,” which I’m very fond of, written by Rabbi Ruth Gan Kagan. The prayer was written in the meter of the original “Prayer for Rain,” in which all the heroes are men (Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, Aaron, and the Twelve Tribes).
Do you see any advantage or problem in adding such a prayer to the machzor?
 
Our God and the God of Our Mothers
 
Remember the mother who, through holy spirit, foresaw like water
Her laughter rolling like streams of water
The way of women You restored to her like water
She nursed sons with an abundance like water
      For her sake, do not withhold water
 
Remember her who went out at evening to draw water
Kindness flowed from her pitcher like water
When she heard, “Let me sip a little water”
She drew until the camels had finished drinking water
      In righteousness, favor us with masses of water
 
Remember the shepherdess who came with the flock to the mouth of the well of water
Wailing bitter tears, weeping like water
Her sister’s eyes were tender with tears of water
You opened her womb like a stream of water
      For their sake, do not withhold water
 
Remember her who stood among the reeds by the river of water
Coaxing the newborns to save them from the darkness of water
With drum and dance she sang by the sea of water
By her merit You brought forth the gift of the well of water
      In righteousness, favor us with masses of water
 
Remember her who sat beneath the palm in the hill country of Ephraim
In the song of the land, the earth trembled; the clouds also dripped water
The stars in their courses fought from heaven
Blessed among women, she gave milk instead of water
      For their sake, do not withhold water
So this is an example of a feminist change, which as far as I can tell does not clash with Jewish law (this is a piyyut within the cantor’s repetition). There are other changes too, loaded with other values as well. What do you say about that?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Answer

It all seems excellent to me. The motives for the change are not important in my eyes, since there are always motives. As for deviating from Jewish law, I don’t know what deviation from Jewish law you were referring to; it would be worthwhile to give an example.

Discussion on Answer

Michi (2017-10-09)

Shloymi:
A deviation from Jewish law (in my view), or a change in Jewish law, would be saying “who has made me in His image” instead of “who has not made me a woman” / “who has made me according to His will,” and “who has made me an Israelite” instead of “who has not made me a gentile,” and the like.
Leaving out from Kiddush: “who has chosen us from among all the peoples.”

There are many such examples in the siddur I mentioned.
—————————
Michi:
Deviating from the wording of blessings really is problematic. Still, one has to remember that if a person says a blessing and does not mean it, his saying it has no significance whatsoever and no point. Therefore, one of two things: either he should convince himself that the blessing has meaning and find for himself a reasonable interpretation, or he should not say it. In such a case, there may perhaps be room to change the formula of the blessings rather than not say them at all.
As an aside, I would add that the blessing “who has not made me a woman” is comparable in my eyes to the blessing “who has not made me an elephant.” If I were an elephant, I would not be me. You can’t make me into an elephant (this is precisely Maimonides’ elephant analogy).
With some effort, one could explain that the intention is to value myself as I am and not really to compare between two alternatives. That already dulls the sting of some of the difficulties with these blessings.
———————
NM:
A comment on that aside — one can learn from the wording of the blessing that, in the eyes of those who instituted it, gender identity was a secondary trait and not a fundamental one. Just as you can thank God for making you tall and not short, because even if you were short you would still be you, so too you can rejoice that you belong to this gender and not another.
Today sexual identity is such a fundamental feature of our identity that without it we no longer perceive ourselves as ourselves, but apparently it was not always perceived that way.
——————————–
Michi:
Precisely today it is much less significant. It can be changed and is not necessarily determined by physiological signs. In any case, the discussion here concerns us, not the Sages.

MoishBB (2017-10-09)

By the way, Shloymi, thanks for bringing this lovely piyyut,
and if only it would be adopted by all of the Jewish people
(pipe dreams…)

David (2017-10-09)

An amazing piyyut
But “The way of women You restored to her like water”?? Sounds a bit crude to me…
As for Sarah’s laughter, I’m not sure that counts as a matriarchal merit.
Still, it is fitting and desirable that it enter the prayer service, and there is no “change from Jewish law” here whatsoever, because if there were, then all piyyutim would be a change from Jewish law.
On the contrary, piyyutim are the free creative element within prayer, by definition.

Shloymi (2017-10-09)

A small correction:
In the last stanza, “In her song” instead of “In the song of.”

By the way, I assume that “for their sake” in the plural in the third stanza refers to Rachel and Leah, and in the last stanza to Deborah and Jael.
Ruth Gan Kagan is a rabbi, a student of Rabbi Zalman Schachter-Shalomi (and ordained by him), of blessed memory, one of the more interesting and fascinating figures among the leaders of modern Orthodoxy in the U.S., a friend and companion of Shlomo Carlebach.

To Moishi — there’s no need to wait for the piyyut to be adopted. On the contrary, if we say it without waiting for anyone’s approval, then it will also carry the value of autonomy, and not only the value of feminism.

Moishbb (2017-10-09)

Well, I wouldn’t go that far — Rabbi Zalman Schachter etc. wasn’t defined anywhere as Orthodox; the most lenient label you could maybe paint him with would be Conservative.
But to the point, the piyyut is lovely.
Maybe in a private minyan it would be possible to start saying it.
Certainly not in the circles I move in, unless I’m in the mood for a shower of etrogs that already had the holiday pass over them.
As for the line “The way of women You restored to her like water”
it’s no more vulgar than the verse that emphasizes it openly.

Shloymi (2017-10-10)

The differences between Orthodox, Conservative, and Reform are in terms of their attitude toward Jewish law. As long as a person accepts the Orthodox conception of Jewish law, he is Orthodox, whether he is right-wing or left-wing, dressed like a Haredi or like a hippie, working as a melamed in a heder or as an actor in Hollywood.

Rabbi Zalman’s innovations were not in the halakhic sphere, and therefore he can be called Orthodox — aside from his problematic statement regarding Sabbath observance (see his Wikipedia entry. See there that some defined his stream as a fourth stream, and did not include it in any of the recognized streams).

Shloymi (2017-10-11)

Today is the eve of Simchat Torah. I call on the readers here on the site to download the “Prayer for Rain” that I attached, print it out, and say it during the cantor’s repetition of Musaf tomorrow. You can also post it on the synagogue bulletin board.

It contains an egalitarian message, an innovative and individualistic message, and it challenges the old system that is unwilling to examine and refresh itself.
The prayer is original, beautiful, and literary.
Happy holiday!

P.S. As mentioned, in the last section it should read “In her song” instead of “In the song of.”

Sarah Friedland Ben Arza (2018-07-01)

In our women’s prayer group, “Shirat Sarah,” which is entirely Orthodox (we are not considered a minyan, and therefore we do not say matters requiring sanctity, but we do read from a kosher Torah scroll with cantillation, and on Simchat Torah we also have a Bride of the Torah and a Bride of Genesis), we added the stanzas of the matriarchs and women to the Prayer for Rain on Shemini Atzeret beginning in the very first year that this prayer was written. And it is sung with joy.

Sarah Friedland Ben Arza (2018-07-01)

I checked and found that we sang it on Simchat Torah 5764, shortly after its publication.

Our God and the God of Our Mothers (2020-10-04)

Today is the eve of Simchat Torah. I call on the readers here on the site to download the “Prayer for Rain” that I attached, print it out, and say it on the holiday.

It contains an egalitarian message, an innovative and individualistic message, and it challenges the old system that is unwilling to examine and refresh itself.
The prayer is original, beautiful, and literary.
Happy holiday!

P.S. As mentioned, in the last section it should read “In her song” instead of “In the song of.”

Our God and the God of Our Mothers – Prayer for Rain Download (2020-10-09)

Our God and the God of Our Mothers

Remember the mother who, through holy spirit, foresaw like water
Her laughter rolling like streams of water
The way of women You restored to her like water
She nursed sons with an abundance like water
For her sake, do not withhold water

Remember her who went out at evening to draw water
Kindness flowed from her pitcher like water
When she heard, “Let me sip a little water”
She drew until the camels had finished drinking water
In righteousness, favor us with masses of water

Remember the shepherdess who came with the flock to the mouth of the well of water
Wailing bitter tears, weeping like water
Her sister’s eyes were tender with tears of water
You opened her womb like a stream of water
For their sake, do not withhold water

Remember her who stood among the reeds by the river of water
Coaxing the newborns to save them from the darkness of water
With drum and dance she sang by the sea of water
By her merit You brought forth the gift of the well of water
In righteousness, favor us with masses of water

Remember her who sat beneath the palm in the hill country of Ephraim
In her song the earth trembled; the clouds also dripped water
The stars in their courses fought from heaven
Blessed among women, she gave milk instead of water
For their sake, do not withhold water

Alternative Prayer for Rain: “Our God and the God of Our Mothers” (2021-09-26)

Reminder — alternative Prayer for Rain for Simchat Torah available for download

Feminist (2022-10-14)

Reminder — alternative Prayer for Rain for Simchat Torah available for download

Michi (2022-10-14)

What dedication! I would suggest dropping the regular piyyut instead of adding another one. But that’s just me and my love for piyyutim, of course.

A suggestion to mix the two piyyutim for Simchat Torah – Our God and the God of Our Mothers and Fathers (2022-10-16)

Maybe, so as not to give up either the old or the new, one could blend them and read alternating stanzas, one from this piyyut and one from the other, and thus create a new piyyut that combines heroes of both genders.
The question is whether, God forbid, there is some forbidden mixing here between men and women, concern for accessories of sexual transgression, and a slippery slope, etc.???

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