Q&A: A rabbi who is an enthusiastic supporter of LGBT people.
A rabbi who is an enthusiastic supporter of LGBT people.
Question
Full disclosure: this question was asked in Column 296 and for some reason did not receive an answer.
Rabbi, you wrote there, "because he is an enthusiastic supporter of LGBT people."
On the other hand, Sefer HaChinukh writes about this regarding male homosexual relations: "That filthy matter is loathsome and very degrading in the eyes of any rational person."
And since this week’s Torah portion dealt with it, I saw fit to try again.
This week, in both portions—Acharei Mot and Kedoshim—
the matter of male homosexual intercourse is mentioned in a way that is not open to interpretation!
Leviticus 18:22: "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a woman; it is an abomination."
The punishment of the two offenders is stated explicitly later: "If a man lies with a male as one lies with a woman, the two of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them" (Leviticus 20:13).
It is important to note that at the time of the Sanhedrin, the punishment for one who intentionally violated this prohibition in front of two witnesses and after being warned was execution by the religious court, by stoning.
I will cite Sefer HaChinukh there: "The blessed God desires the settling of His world which He created, and therefore He commanded that they not destroy their seed through lying with males, for it is truly a destruction in which there is no productive benefit and no conjugal commandment, aside from the fact that this filthy matter is loathsome and very degrading in the eyes of any rational person. And a man, who was created to serve his Creator, is not fit to disgrace himself with such degrading acts."
Besides the prohibition, the matter of its ugliness is also mentioned, and adjacent to it the matter of one who lies with an animal is mentioned. (There, verse 23: "And you shall not lie with any beast to defile yourself with it; nor shall a woman stand before a beast to mate with it—it is perversion.")
So are you also an enthusiastic supporter of those who lie with animals? I am astonished!
And because of this I wonder: how can a religious person who loves his Creator (and especially a rabbi, who has responsibility even toward those who hear his words) be capable of saying that he is an enthusiastic supporter of such people?!
1. Does the Rabbi mean compassion, as one would have for any lowly person who deserves pity?
2. And if so, is the Rabbi also an enthusiastic supporter of pedophiles? (It should be noted that there is no prohibition of pedophilia in the Torah.)
3. If not, what is the distinction? After all, both act out of inclinations. (The acts of a pedophile are by consent.)
4. And what about a murderer, who does not understand that if he has murderous inclinations his fellow is not to blame for that—should one only pity him, or also be his enthusiastic supporter?
5. In your opinion, are you thereby fulfilling the will of God in all these cases? And if so, how do you know this is His will, after He has already revealed to us clearly what His will is, and what His opinion is of such people.
Have a lovely week, and thanks in advance.
Tam.
Answer
A lovely week to you too.
As usual, you are once again quoting in a distorted way. I did not write that anywhere.
As for the rest of your questions, irrespective of what I wrote, I refer you to the columns that dealt with this matter. Everything is answered there.
Discussion on Answer
With God's help, 9 Iyar 5780
To Tam—hello,
The "rules of the game" of democracy are that even if I see a person’s actions as improper, I do not prevent him from doing them so long as he does not harm others.
Accordingly, there is room to say that even though we as believing Jews view LGBT behavior as a grave prohibition, like desecration of the Sabbath, idolatry, and sexual transgressions, nevertheless we would not support coercively imposing the prohibition on them, because at present the path of tolerance is preferable, since there is a greater chance that they will repent and that the verse will be fulfilled in them: "and they accepted His kingship willingly upon themselves."
Regarding pedophiles and murderers, the problem is that they do what they do without the consent of the victim, for a child’s consent is meaningless, and therefore reason cannot tolerate allowing them to do such acts.
Best regards, Shatz
An example of the distinction between "supporting so-and-so’s right" and "supporting so-and-so’s opinion" you can see on this very site, whose owner allows even opinions to be presented here that he opposes with the utmost force 🙂
Shatz, you answered well. More power to you.
More power to you, Shatz.
A fine distinction, except that in my opinion, a person who supports not coercing his view on others should say that he is an enthusiastic supporter of not depriving others of their rights, and not say that he is an enthusiastic supporter of others’ rights. But your answer definitely sits well with the heart.
Have a lovely rest of the day.
Following the Rabbi’s remarks in the previous responsum, I will stop, God willing, and try to be matter-of-fact.
(By the way, I asked several people from the outside, because apparently my feelings of inferiority caused me to feel what I thought I was feeling, and apparently those I asked also do not constitute an indication, and I accept that!)
I apologize; I will try to check myself several times in the future beforehand. It is possible that I was hasty.
As for the substance of the question, I did indeed check, and the Rabbi wrote that he is an enthusiastic supporter of LGBT rights. And I do not really see much difference; surely an enthusiastic supporter of the rights of pedophiles or murderers mentioned above would also require an explanation?
(The Rabbi is not obligated to answer, since I erred in the quotation and was hasty; but if the Rabbi still has some patience, I would be happy to hear.)