Q&A: A Child Who Knows the Entire Torah
A Child Who Knows the Entire Torah
Question
Good evening!
There is a famous story that almost no Haredi person failed to hear in childhood, about a child in Jerusalem seventy years ago who, when he began to speak, could quote by heart the entire Talmud, medieval authorities, later authorities, and so on. Until he came before the Belzer Rebbe and began to forget it all (there are several versions of what happened there).
Until today I thought this was just a legend, with no details and no substance. Well, today I actually spoke with the child himself (he is 75) and questioned him thoroughly (I even have documentation. In principle he usually is not interested in talking, but for a certain reason, which is not the place to spell out here, he agreed to speak with me). I won’t tell the whole story now, but the basic fact that as a child he really did know how to recite the entire Torah is, without a doubt, true!
I’d be glad to hear the Rabbi’s opinion about this story.
Answer
It seems to me this already came up here. I have no opinion. Usually I’m skeptical about stories like these, and there can always be explanations that it wasn’t really as described. But even if it was—then yes. There are also children who know how to play the piano without having learned. I brought such a case in The Science of Freedom.
Discussion on Answer
I have no explanation. But it is an indication of the existence of spirit.
Can you upload a link to the documentation?
It was on the program True Faces with Amnon Levy, season 2 episode 1. Search online.
Papagio,
Do you intend to publish the documentation?
What did he tell you about his meeting with the Belzer Rebbe of blessed memory?
A few more things to ask Rabbi Papagio:
Does he still remember the entire Torah, or has he already forgotten everything? Did you ask him which books he knew, since there are many stories about which books he did or did not know?
1- At the moment I can’t publish it (I promised him), but if you want, I can tell you about it in detail.
2- He remembers that the Rebbe tested him and prayed, and after a period during which he did not speak about it with people, little by little he forgot. (The version that the Rebbe slapped him above the lips is not correct.)
1- He said that he forgot everything (although I read elsewhere that he does still remember).
2- He knew by heart the Babylonian and Jerusalem Talmuds, medieval authorities (for example Rashba and Rif), and some of the later authorities.
I don’t understand why one should believe the child [today a 75-year-old man]. In what way is he more credible?
I don’t understand what practical difference it makes.
As Rabbi Michael Abraham wrote, this is only an indication of the existence of spirit.
The words of the Sages do not need reinforcement. Either one accepts them or not, and that is why it is called “faith in the sages.”
To me, actually, it seems that the story never happened at all, since there are things that harm people’s free choice, but that’s just me (and therefore I don’t believe in séances, near-death experiences, etc., because it contradicts free choice. If they really experienced what they describe, they would not dare commit any transgression, not even absentmindedly, because that world truly is, as its name implies, the truth, and there is no escaping it). And if someone is impressed by this, then he is in exactly the same position as the student of Rabbi Yohanan the amora.
Niv, I’ll tell you about myself as someone who is fairly sure of the story, and even so, in practice I was not strengthened at all.
A question for Rabbi Papagio:
If that man forgot everything, then how does he remember what he knew before he forgot?
He doesn’t remember the material itself that he knew, if only because he did not understand what he was reciting, but he remembers the situation, and the people around him described what they tested him on. (He even showed me letters from several important and well-known rabbis who wrote to him what they had tested him on.)
How do you explain the case of children who know how to play the piano without learning?