Q&A: Historical Facts in the Talmud
Historical Facts in the Talmud
Question
When the Talmud says, “the water channel flowed backward and the tree was uprooted from its place,” that is certainly not a historical datum but an idea, or that some tanna slept for 70 years, and so on. But let’s say statements that appear in the course of a Talmudic passage, and not in aggadic material—do we necessarily have to accept them as they are?
For example—a serious Talmudic passage like the one saying that the Jewish people began idol worship only in order to permit themselves forbidden sexual relations, and they raise objections and answers so that it seems they really mean it—are we obligated to accept that as historical truth, or here too can one say that it is coming to express an idea?
When there is a dispute between two amoraim in the Talmud, does it necessarily mean that they actually disagreed about that, or that the editors of the Talmud wanted there to be a dispute about it (according to your approach—to create a range of possibilities and dynamism in halakhic ruling), and therefore attached the names of amoraim to it, even though they did not really disagree about it? And can one say that there are amoraim who are entirely fictional and never existed at all?
I am not asking whether this is specifically on the conceptual side, only whether it is logical and reasonable to say that it is conceptual, or whether in your view that is unreasonable.
Thank you very much, and blessings to you in this world and the next!
Answer
Even if the tannaim and amoraim intended a historical claim, that does not mean it must be accepted. There is no formal authority regarding facts. I do not think names were invented and attached to opinions. That is very unlikely.
Discussion on Answer
I don’t understand. Are you asking whether you are allowed to realize that it does not seem likely to you that it happened? If it doesn’t seem likely, then it doesn’t seem likely.
I’m asking whether, when we have no indication that something indeed did not happen, I can still say that it does not seem likely to me that, for example, the story of Rabbi Akiva’s execution happened as described, or that Beruriah jumped from the window, or that Ben Azzai never married… that is, historical details that are given to us about their lives.